Regina Doherty (Meath East, Fine Gael) | Oireachtas source

Many people have sought under freedom of information, FOI, legislation all of the documentation regarding meetings of interdepartmental groups right back as far as 1996. At no stage was there ever any indication or action arising from the thought process that there would be any legislation passed or anything to give anybody the impression that this was a national identity card by the side door, the back door or the front door. That fear, while real for a small number of people, is unfounded.

For the record, there is an assumption that members of my party have a great wish to have a national identity card. I would abhor anybody walking down the road or anywhere being stopped and asked to produce papers. It has massively negative connotations for me and I would not be able to support anybody who wants to introduce it. Regardless of whether we have a national debate about it, which is what people keep calling for, I would not agree, sign up and subscribe to a policy that would introduce a national identity card. For the record, I do not agree with it.

There were eight findings. The difficulty I have in answering the questions without sounding like a smart-arse is that none of the eight findings has any force in law. There is no enforcement notice and since 15 August, none has been issued as of yet. I have nothing to challenge other than to say to the Deputy that I do not agree with any of the eight findings, not even the first one. While that might sound bad, I do not have the ability to do anything other than wait.

It was never the case that the instructions that were given to us to be complied with in seven days, within 21 days and, in the final instructions, within 60 days, were ever to be complied with because we do not agree with them. My legal advice is that the interpretation of the legislation by the Data Protection Commissioner's, DPC's, office is incorrect. In fact, the advice we have been given is that if we did any of the things we were instructed to do, we would be acting outside of the legislation and effectively breaking the law. While it might seem disrespectful, I find that we are in limbo. Had the enforcement notice arrived on 15 August, we would have taken our time to look at it, get all of the advice and look at all of our practices over the past 20 years. We do not have anything to legally challenge and until I have something to legally challenge, the eight findings that were issued in the report - the instructions that were issued in the DPC's letter - do not have any legal force and we will not be enacting any of the instructions. If and when an enforcement notice is issued, we will consider carefully the instructions in that enforcement notice. If there are things in it with which we agree, we will comply. If there are things in it with which we disagree, our only recourse to challenge that is through the courts.

The Deputy asked about the photograph and the passport, as to whether one had the ability to get the passport by means other than having a PSC. One always had the ability to go the old route. That has never changed. That is to facilitate people of all walks of life who do not necessarily like technology. There are lots of people who still do not even send text messages. We need to be able to provide public services in the manner that people expect to be able to use. The most efficient manner for most people these days is online, which is why we have 3.2 million active users of the PSC and hundreds of thousands of people on a weekly basis who use it to get public services in a more efficient manner. However, all other routes to be able to accommodate other people should be facilitated by each and every Department. At the end of the day we are here to serve, not to control.

The Department is only the data controller of all of the data that are stored. I do not have the directive powers to tell other Ministers how to draft and run schemes that come out of their offices but the governing responsibility allows them to ask people. If people want to do business with the State online, they must be able to prove their identity and the most efficient way to be able to do so is through the SAFE 2 registration process, as 3.2 million people have found.

Lastly, the national childcare scheme was always in its foundations to have two ways to apply for it. One was to be paper and one was to be online. In order for one to make an application online through mygov.ie, one needs a PSC. Some 80% of those who will qualify for the childcare scheme subsidies have already got a PSC and the paper form is going live on 1 January. The Deputy is correct in stating that there is a month of a difference between the online version and the paper version.