Mr. Victor Chestnutt:

On behalf of the Ulster Farmers' Union, I thank the committee for the invitation to attend this meeting. It is a pity we are not here in better circumstances. However, we are where we are. Mr. Healy gave an impressive opening statement in which he laid out the past and where we are, so I will try not to be repetitive.

We all know where this crisis began. The Ulster Farmers' Union did not campaign one way or the other but our membership was split. We did hold an event for farmers at which each option was debated. We take our decision-making from our membership. The position of the Ulster Farmers' Union from the start was that in the absence of a compelling reason to leave, there was no reason to do so. We felt this was the right decision to take. We then moved to former Prime Minister Theresa May's first deal, which included a Northern Ireland backstop. We reviewed the deal. Approximately 85% of our produce in Northern Ireland is sold to the GB market. As such, it is our main market. We noted that the first agreement provided for free and frictionless trade for our producers to the British market, which is our main concern. Having been reassured of this, we supported the agreement. As everybody is aware, this debate has been very political from the beginning. In taking that decision and sticking our heads up, we received a great deal of criticism, which in some instances was quite nasty. We are where we are and we stand by that decision.

We have moved on from that point. As we all know, former Prime Minister Theresa May's deal did not get support and there is a new deal on the table. Mr. Healy commented on that deal and mentioned that for Northern Ireland it is the best of both worlds. We are not so sure about that. There are matters on which we need clarification. I would like at this point to set some background to the Northern Ireland industry. Approximately 30%, or 642 million litres, of the milk produced in Northern Ireland goes to the UK; 12% to the Republic of Ireland, ROI; 17% to other EU countries; and 6% to the remainder of the world. All live calves in the dairy trade go to the South and onwards through southern exporters. In regard to beef and sheep, our exports to ROI are worth €83 million. The value of live cattle exports is €9 million. Some 40% of the lambs we produce in Northern Ireland go to the South for slaughter.

I farm as far north as one can get in Northern Ireland. From our farm, one can see over to Scotland. As we speak, there is a lorry picking up lambs to go to Irish Country Meats in Navan. We have done this for the past number of years. A total of 40% of our lambs come south for slaughter. It is not all one-way trade. In the pig sector, 27% of the pigs we kill in Northern Ireland come from the Republic of Ireland. The food industry on the island of Ireland is completely integrated and to try to rip it apart makes no sense. In the poultry sector, 11% of meat goes to the Republic of Ireland - day-olds and chicks. A total of 50% of laying hens go to the Republic of Ireland for slaughter while the other 50% goes to Great Britain. Chicken parts are rendered and some of the rendered material goes to the Republic of Ireland. Some of our litter goes to a biodigester in Donegal while our feathers go to Cork for manufacture so the industry is completely integrated along with some of our produce that is manufactured in Northern Ireland and goes out through Dublin Port. It goes without saying that to try to rip this apart makes no sense at all.

I said that we have a deal on the table but we need clarity. One of the main things exercising us is what would happen to Northern Ireland produce if it was processed in the South. Can it then be treated as Irish and go to the rest of the world as part of EU trade deals? Mr. Healy raised this point. If this produce cannot go to the rest of the world as part of EU trade deals, Irish companies in the South may not want our produce if they cannot market it. The lambs coming from my area to Irish Country Meats in Navan are not coming down to the food market in the South. They are coming down here for processing to go to the rest of the world so they need to be able to access those EU trade deals. We have asked for clarification on this but have received conflicting clarifications. Tom Tynan, a member of Commissioner Phil Hogan's staff, is telling us one thing while our own Government is telling us something else so we are waiting for clarification on that point.

It is the same the other way round. There are qualifying goods. When pigs come up to Cookstown to be slaughtered, which is where the main plant for slaughtering pigs from the Republic of Ireland is located, are processed and go into the British market, do they constitute a qualifying good? Does all pigmeat out of Cookstown then not become a qualifying good? These are the sort of questions to which we need answers so it works both ways. We need those issues to be clarified.

Where are we as far as politics is concerned? It is changing by the hour. It is very fluid. I was over in Westminster with the president giving evidence in a situation similar to this. Afterwards, we spoke to our own MPs in the lobby. At that time, we thought that the DUP would be able to back this deal but we know what has happened since. Who is to know what the next steps are? It seems to be one step and two steps backwards. Mr. Healy is right that Brexit has not only had an impact in the South. We are already feeling the impact in the North. Our milk is 2.3 pence a litre behind the UK price this year. Our sheep are probably about £20 per skull behind the price in the South simply because the southern companies were more anxious to supply Southern lamb rather than Northern lamb because of its security. Regarding our beef, the figure we reckoned we lost due to Brexit was £27 million a month ago. We have no EU or UK beef aid scheme in Northern Ireland so our farmers are feeling the pinch.

On a more positive note, this deal does seem to be the basis of something if we can get some clarity, particularly around goods coming from the North to the South to be processed or goods from the South coming north to be processed. Can these goods be included in EU trade deals or enter the UK market? We would welcome clarification on that. We may be able to come out and support it. From the word go, the Ulster Farmers' Union was constant in saying we cannot have a no-deal situation. We have been resolute on this every time we were asked about it. Some of our politicians said earlier on that they were quite content to go out with no deal. I think we have managed through our lobbying to get through to them and hardly any politicians north of the Border say that now. We have worked on that. We would like to see this uncertainty pass and for us to get to the start line but, as Mr. Healy rightly noted, that is just the start line. We must then negotiate a trade deal but we have had a good history for years as neighbours in the agrifood industry and this history has been reinforced by the complete integration of the food chain on the island of Ireland. Sometimes it frustrates me when I hear the issue of Border communities being raised because this is not about Border communities. It is about the whole island of Ireland. I farm as far north as one can get. My son's milk goes to the South, as do my lambs. My wool goes to Donegal. The whole thing is completely integrated. It is not a strip around the Border so as far as the North is concerned, for the sake of the prosperity of agriculture, we need to do something sensible to get this worked out. Any negotiation always involves a wee bit of give and take.