Mr. Martin Varley:

Deputy Donnelly has asked a very important question. It has been going around my mind for the past seven years. When will people really engage at ministerial level and at official level? I ask this question after representing the food sector and the health sector since 1990. I am not a novice in representation. Prior to that, I worked for two years in the Department of Finance. I have an understanding of what officials are there to do. That is the nub of the problem.

We have an inexplicable position where the Minister of the day is not engaging on an issue and the senior officials in the relevant Department, or potentially Departments, are not engaging either. My understanding, prior to moving to the private sector, was a civil servant had a responsibility to analyse problems and formulate the best solutions. We have made most of the analysis ourselves and I have not seen any from the other side. It is a win-win solution and would be better than cost-neutral, as we have alluded to, if we allow for the better outcomes for patients, leading to shorter stays in hospitals, fewer medical bills and less home or nursing homecare. If we leave patients on lengthy waiting lists, as we are, it becomes a big problem for the effectiveness of delivery of care across the spectrum. There would be a large cost saving.

I again request what we have repeatedly asked of the Minister. I ask him to engage and sit down with us. The question is why he is not sitting down with us. Any public servant with a role to deliver more effective and efficient service in the State should sit down with the organisation that is coming to the table with solutions and pointing out the direction of travel. If that public servant is not sitting down with that organisation, it indicates a problem somewhere on the other side.