Mr. Jeremy Masding:

Yes, because it is probably disproportionately penal for the Irish banks versus the European banks. I am sure that the Senator will have read the Department of Finance and Goodbody reports on mortgage pricing. It is penal and, therefore, the ROEs in Irish banking are depressed, which contributes to there being more sellers than buyers.

The third reason that ROEs are low is the lack of liquidity in the Permanent TSB stock. There is only 25% free flow and the spread between buyers and sellers has become wide, causing the sale of some shares to have a disproportionate effect. The Senator might say I would be expected to say this, and he will probably smile, but we made enormous progress at the end of 2018. On the day of the results, there was not a lot of trading but the share price fell by 5% due to one factor only, namely, the lack of liquidity.

As for what I can control, I can control the business performance of Permanent TSB. We delivered on our promises in 2018 and will continue to do so. When considered as a whole, in respect of one's core beliefs about the market in which one operates, my core belief is that if decisions are taken to maximise the intrinsic value of the bank over time, the market value will follow eventually. While it is taking much longer than I had hoped, I still believe in the organisation and that its intrinsic value is strong.

I still believe that this management team will continue to deliver. The story will get stronger, which can be seen in the numbers. I believe - rather, I have to believe - that the market value will eventually catch up.