Oireachtas Joint and Select Committees

Thursday, 8 November 2018

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach

Finance Bill 2018: Committee Stage (Resumed)

10:00 am

Photo of Paschal DonohoePaschal Donohoe (Dublin Central, Fine Gael) | Oireachtas source

I will address the Deputies' points. As Deputy O'Brien said, this has already been the subject of debate in the Oireachtas. My officials were in front of the committee and this is the report that we produced before the summer.

Deputy Burton said at the start of her statement that I gave an extensive answer to the questions she raised and at the end she said that I had given a bland response, looking to brush away issues. I hope the first part of her statement is correct and not the second part. I am not shying away from anything. I have been involved in this issue for over a year, trying to deal with the different issues that are at stake. These are not discussions but negotiations on two different things. The first is a matter that Deputy Burton called out well, which is the design and implementation of a tax like this. As the Deputy acknowledged, the yield involved in such a tax is in many cases much lower than people might expect for a number of reasons. In the UK example that the Deputy used, where billions of pounds were talked about being raised, it was across a five-year period. Per year, it is a measure worth £400 million sterling. It is entirely possible that if this tax was implemented in the way currently proposed, it could represent a loss in some jurisdictions such as ours. For other jurisdictions, the compliance involved in implementing it and some of the things that would need to be done would mean that the revenue brought in would be lower than expected. Once the compliance costs were baked into it, the return that the exchequer in other countries would get would be much lower than people expected. The journey that the previous Chancellor of the Exchequer in the UK, George Osborne, went on with what he referred to as the "Google tax" was an example of this. The yield was much lower than had been anticipated.

I have been substantively involved in this matter over the last year. In one area, the figures and yields involved in it from our point of view and that of other countries would be much lower than people might expect. The area of greatest concern for me is the many principles involved in this. If the principles are reapplied for open service exporting economies, they could be very significant. The principle of a group of countries or the European Union as a whole going down this path while we do not have agreement with other trading partners regarding how it should be implemented is a concern. If that happens, those other trading partners could make decisions on trade and tax co-operation that would have very serious consequences for the European Union and could be difficult for Ireland. For those reasons, I acknowledge that I expect to see change in this area but think Ireland needs to be clear regarding the best route in which we believe that should happen. It is notable that across the last number of weeks, we have seen a number of other economies which are small, open and service-oriented say the same thing as Ireland has said. I will not agree to a report because I would ask Deputies to be aware that I am involved in negotiations on this, not discussions, and if this committee wants information or clarification on any negotiations under way, I will supply it promptly.

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