Oireachtas Joint and Select Committees

Tuesday, 6 November 2018

Select Committee on Health

Health (Regulation of Termination of Pregnancy) Bill 2018: Committee Stage

11:00 am

Photo of Simon HarrisSimon Harris (Wicklow, Fine Gael) | Oireachtas source

There is probably great excitement that this woman is pregnant and going to have a baby but all of a sudden some terrible tragedy has hit the family whereby this woman is in a very dire situation, for which I know we all have compassion. That is the situation we are talking about, not the general situation without specific indication or pre-12 weeks so, in that sense, it is quite different.

I very much take the point made by Deputy O'Connell. We are all trying to land on the same point here. There are things that we have to be prescriptive about in legislation, and we had that debate a few minutes ago when we discussed timelines and grounds. There are other things that we should not be prescriptive about, and I do not think the doctors think we should be either. For example, we have not defined on purpose what reasonable opinion is or in good faith because we have to allow doctors, who know what they are doing and are working with, which is probably the wrong phrase to use, to consult and make decisions. They are consulting with the woman on her medical choices as well, particularly medical choices that are going to directly affect her health or life in a very serious way in these situations. We are providing an opportunity here to define what we need to define and to not define what, quite frankly, the doctors are better to define. I am sure we are going to continue to debate what is appropriate to define and not define. In this case I think our doctors know what is meant by the term "extraordinary" because it above and beyond what they would do if a woman today, in her full health, walked into a hospital to have a birth and had a baby prematurely. The doctors would know what to do in that case. The legislation refers to a different situation. This is a tragic situation where there is a risk to health or life so doctors have to make decisions.

We all want to get this right.

I do not think we are actually a million miles apart. I suggest that we actually ask the people who are writing the clinical guidelines, the medical colleges, their views on this issue and on the word "extraordinary". Perhaps Deputy O'Connell's wording or Deputy Donnelly's is better. I am not precious about the wording. I am trying to make sure that the doctor knows that this is not the normal or regular situation where a woman has gone in and is about to have her baby early. This is a very particular situation in which there is a risk to the woman's health or to her life and in which doctors have to make decisions. I am trying to apply the bar that gives the doctor the flexibility to make the decision he or she knows is right.

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