Michelle Mulherin (Fine Gael) | Oireachtas source

On agriculture, the talk is always about decarbonising Ireland. I know that for the purpose of debate we talk in generalities. Other than at the Joint Committee on Agriculture, Food and the Marine where we prepared that report, the impression is often that farmers can be collateral damage regarding the efforts we make. I feel that was the impression the Citizens' Assembly gave to agriculture in its recommendation. I do not accept this as somebody who comes from that region and sees the significance that farming has to rural areas. We can talk about dairy, but if beef is taken out of the equation at one sweep, it would close down the west and north west.

The witnesses alluded to forestry. I do not consider it a community where people are looking out at trees, and this is a problem. I know there are competing interests. As other colleagues here have done, I would also like to highlight the real issues of ordinary people on the ground.

We have targets for Food Wise 2025. We are selling food into 180 countries. If these beef farmers, who seem to be a problem for so many people, are removed from the equation, it will not be just the farmers who are gone. They supply to people finishing the beef and the whole food industry. What the Climate Change Advisory Council is proposing is massive.

I agree that we need to try to improve the situation, as do farmers and the farming organisations. At the end of the day, when we talk about decarbonisation of society, we still have to eat, so why not have Ireland become the carbon-efficient people? If this idea is taken to the extreme, we would all become vegans. Where is the choice in all this? Where is the reality in all this? It does not match with what I see. I would be in favour of innovation, thinking outside the box and all the rest. Much of the conversation seems to be at an academic level.

In my area there have been objections to wind farms, transmission and everything else. I have never seen the people, who are telling us that we need all of this, at a public meeting advocating why we need this infrastructure etc. The people on ground and their public representatives are trying to advance the cause of their areas and also help people deal with the fallout of being asked to cater for infrastructure. Everybody is an expert at the round table but when they go on the ground, they are not listening to the ordinary person and the ordinary communities who are being asked to facilitate infrastructure. As the witness said, the margins for farmers are so small because they are so regulated in everything they do. As Senator Paul Daly said, they are taking great steps towards reducing carbon emissions. While farmers and the farming organisations must step up to the plate, if we want to bring them with us we need to acknowledge what they are doing.