Eamon Ryan (Dublin Bay South, Green Party) | Oireachtas source

As I have five minutes I will make more of a statement but I hope it will lead to a question. I thank the secretariat, Ms Justice Laffoy and the 99 members of the Citizens' Assembly. They have done the State real service and set an international example that has been noticed in terms of how engagement with people on complex issues can work. Ms Justice Laffoy did the job really well on climate as well as on other issues and I thank her for that.

I am interested in Ms Justice Laffoy's comment that since then there has been a series of developments so that we are being asked a different question, which is true. Our role is as policymakers and some members are part of the Government, which involves real decisions about real investment. The circumstances have changed in that the Government has now admitted failure. We must have a new national climate energy plan in place by Christmas. In my understanding of the legal system that supersedes everything, so we have a huge challenge.

I am concerned about putting out the message that if only we were informed about climate change we would end up with the right decisions. I think most people in this country and around the world are informed about climate change. The story of climate change has been told for 30 years and the science has been certain for most of that. As we heard in the private briefing this morning the science is now categoric and is not questioned. Perhaps the assembly helped in the sense of getting the message across that in tackling it we would bring about a better Ireland. The information we need to have is how we can achieve that. To my mind we will not tackle climate change if we just say to people that they have to stop going from A to B, which is a punitive or restrictive approach. We must have a transformative moment whereby we realise there is a better alternative in C, which will give rise to a better Ireland, a better economy and society. Information around that is the key objective.

There is much attention on agriculture and we will look at that in detail. I was very pleased to be able to sit on the sidelines of the session in Malahide when the National Transport Authority presented its analysis from the transport perspective but to be honest, I was bitterly disappointed at the lack of vision, ambition and sense of how we could be different. I mention that because Ms Justice Laffoy cited that since her report we have had the new national development plan, which to my mind ignored the assembly's recommendations. I know that some have different views based on their political position. We have 63 new national motorway and road projects already planned and in construction. There are PPPs involved so people make money out of it. Everything is ready to go. The State is looking at three public transport projects.

I mention that because I attended a meeting last night of the Nutley Residents Association. Other members will be familiar with the experience. Nutley Lane was a lane 50 or 60 years ago and the plan is now to turn it pretty much into a four-lane motorway and to put in a bus lane. I am in favour of bus lanes and cycle lanes but I fear that if we asked the 100 citizens who attended last night's meeting to vote on whether to proceed with this particular section of road that we would not get a 95% "Yes" vote. In fact, I fear the vote would go the other way. I cite that as an example. An interesting question is on how we get this dialogue at a local council policy level in order to make the leap to convince the people on Nutley Lane that it will turn Nutley Lane into part of Copenhagen and it is not just that lane which is taking the hit. We must be flexible in how we do it. To my mind, that is the scale of the information that is needed and that is the scale of the challenge we face. I put it to Ms Justice Laffoy that it is not just a case of saying, "Here is the science now do the right thing". I think it must be a case of saying, "Here is the science and here is the better Ireland and here are the ways to achieve it". We will make mistakes and we will have to stop and start again. That is one response to the conversation here.

Ms Justice Laffoy is not just an esteemed citizen but a former Supreme Court judge. Following on from the questions asked by the Chair earlier, from having looked at the issue and based on her experience as a Supreme Court judge, is there a legal change we need to make? Is there something we can do in term of the Constitution to strengthen the rights of the environment? This is such a difficult task. Is our legal system and Constitution serving us in terms of providing some of the guidelines and a rights base? As a former Supreme Court judge does Ms Justice Laffoy believe we have adequate constitutional provisions? I know that is a very big question but I thought I would ask it given that I had the chance.