Mr. Peter Nolan:

I will elaborate on what some of the points made by my colleagues, specifically on corporate status and the future direction of the utility. It is important to consider from where this proposal came. It did not come from the Government, Oireachtas or Irish Water; it came from Ervia. There is a cultural difference between Irish Water, which tried to root itself in the public service, and the manner in which Ervia operates. From that perspective, we fear that this is the route to privatisation and that fear is grounded. Developments are taking place within Ervia in an attempt to evolve the management structures of Irish Water staff with Ervia staff. The committee needs to pay close attention to that development because it is the route towards privatisation. We believe the service can be run by local authorities, but we are also open to considering any proposal that would totally preserve the delivery of services within the public sector. We are opposed to commercial development of the water service and that message needs to go out loud and clear.

On the question of staff efficiencies, it is difficult to see how capital investment could be sustained with a reduced number of staff. Since we started to engage with Irish Water, we have kept the system running in local authorities and have managed to reduce staffing levels by close to 1,000. We have the capacity. We have shrunk the system as far as it can go, but we have never been found wanting in circumstances where we have been met and engaged and delivered.

The final point I want to address is local government, which is very dear to my union's heart. We predate the foundation of the State as a union founded in local government. We have talked about bins and higher education. The loss of water services will take between 20% and 30% of the income base from local authorities. Some local authorities in the Dublin area, to which Mr. Berney alluded, may withstand such a reduction but I doubt that, notwithstanding what management thinks. Smaller local authorities will be devastated. The funding from Irish Water is used to pay for corporate services, not just operational staff on the ground. This funding is no longer available. Approximately one third of the funding for the services delivered by local authorities will disappear on the day this occurs.

We will continue to engage. The creation of Irish Water occurred in turmoil. The one constant throughout was the willingness of the trade union movement to sit down and deal with problems. We did not get involved in large measure with much of the public debate on the issue.

There is a sense of disappointment that the people who kept the show on the road are now staring down the barrel of the gun. Our people refer to the proposal to transfer staff from local authorities to a new body as "conscription". We understand there is legislative provision to allow for this. Any organisation that tries to set itself up when its workforce is totally opposed to the arrangement is destined for a fall and we believe that, unless there is engagement and we are able to deal with the issues we are outlining this morning, the difficulties we face will increase.