Oireachtas Joint and Select Committees

Tuesday, 29 May 2018

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health

Joint Meeting of the Joint Committee on Employment Affairs and Social Protection, Joint Committee on Education and Skills and Joint Committee on Health
Supports for People with Disabilities: Discussion (Resumed)

12:00 pm

Photo of Alice-Mary HigginsAlice-Mary Higgins (Independent) | Oireachtas source

The presentations have been really wonderful and lots of issues have been raised. I will try to avoid some of the ones which have already been touched on, including the important point around the role of the embargo on public service recruitment. I was struck by the issue of invisibility which Mr. Kearney spoke about. He referred to invisible disability. I was also struck by that issue in the context of what Mr. Alford said about residential institutions. He said that when he was in residential care, he was unable to participate in his community and was not given the necessary level of visibility. He has described how he now has that.

I was also struck in particular by how that is reflected in payments and the invalidity pension. I also sit on the social protection committee and I am very interested in why a person would be on that payment rather than on disability allowance, which would permit some capacity to work. It is a real worry that they are waiting for a person to become 66 when the disability will disappear. It seems that those who are working or who are not on disability allowance see their disability or needs disappear because they are no longer on that payment. It is a real concern given that there are people with disabilities who are working, who are older and who are younger. They are in all those other parts of the system. As such, the idea that a person comes into focus every now and again is a real concern. The witnesses might comment on that. I was struck by the idea that the pension penalises involvement, be it in politics or volunteerism.

Ms McAnaspie spoke about this also. One wants a system that encourages one and good points were made on work experience, transition year and career guidance. A narrative is coming across all the time that supports are in tension with work and engagement, which should not be the case. We have a constant concern around loss of supports in relation to employment versus the narrative we need around supports which assist engagement. Ms Ní Mhaolain spoke very well about the idea of assistive supports. Does any witness want to comment on how to reframe the dialogue around supports?

I was struck also by the amount of unpaid time required to negotiate bureaucracy and the gaps that opens up in one's career path or personal progression. It is a huge amount of time. Mr. Moran and Mr. Alford referred in particular to the huge amount of time that has had to be put in on advocacy to improve our services. What Mr. Moran said about it being important that it be there at the beginning was striking. We must have representatives in all of these institutions and committees at board level so that it does not fall to individual advocates. Nonetheless, the witnesses might want to speak further to the optional protocol which is a way for individual advocates to press for improvements and demand justice from our systems. That said, it should not fall to individuals to take those cases.

I have specific points for Ms Daly. She spoke about transition points. This is what we are really trying to tackle here. The points on post-education supports were striking. These are supports post-education around a person's next step. She also mentioned further education. Something that is a real concern for us on the social protection committee is the need to ensure that people are given further education options. People in the social welfare system may not be coming straight out of secondary school and into college. How do we ensure that further education is brought in and that people in their 30s and 40s are brought back into the education system? What has been Ms Daly's experience?

Mr. Alford spoke about the importance of choice very eloquently; the choice of who one lives and works with, who supports one. The personal budget is a key part of that.

I was also struck by what he said about having a reserve of funds because he had been wrongly exploited in the past, which allowed him make long-term plans. Could people touch on the issue of how it can be difficult for persons on disability allowance to make the big leaps or the investment in a substantial change in their life? The personalised budget is a weekly payment but how can we support moments of big change and give people the capacity to plan their own futures?

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