Mark Daly (Fianna Fail) | Oireachtas source

I join with the Chairman on this, the 44th anniversary of the Dublin and Monaghan bombings, in extending my sympathies to the families and the loved ones of the bereaved in what was one of the biggest mass murders in the history of the State.

Professor Phinnemore raised several issues. The House of Commons Northern Ireland Affairs Committee has produced a report in the last six weeks entitled, "The land border between Northern Ireland and Ireland". It stated it has had no visibility of any technological solutions beyond the theoretical or aspirational that would remove the need for physical infrastructure at the Border. Am I right in saying the only way those infrastructure needs would be removed or not required in any future arrangement is for the UK to remain within the Single Market and customs union, and effectively not leave the EU, and therefore, to all intents and purposes, it would not be able to have any trading arrangements that would allow it to diverge from the current status quoin terms of the EU's arrangements with third countries?

My next question concerns the deep politicisation of the Border and the issue of a border poll which has arisen due to Brexit, and increasingly on the unionist side. Unionist commentators like Alex Kane have written that unionism can no longer ignore the issue of a border poll, given the changing demographics in Northern Ireland and the reality that, if there is a Brexit in the manner the Brexiteers are looking to achieve, it will be a hard Brexit with a hard border, and with worse economic consequences for Northern Ireland than for any other part of the UK. We have also seen Lady Sylvia Hermon talk about the fact there would be a border poll in her lifetime and, more recently, this week, the British Prime Minister said she believed the unionists would not win a border poll.

The fact it is referred to as a border poll is ironic because, although we are talking about the Border, it is a referendum on the future of Northern Ireland and the provisions of the Good Friday Agreement, not just about removing a border. While it is not an essential part of what we are discussing, it is out there and it would end the Border, which I suppose would put the witnesses out of a job in terms of talking about solutions for the Border. Some estimates from the unionist community suggest, and people I have spoken to reckon, there will be a referendum within their lifetime, some say within ten years and some within five. Dr. Paul Nolan's more recent comments about the census results in 2021 and the changing demographics would lead us to believe there will be one within this decade.

Does Dr. Phinnemore have any thoughts on that? He might like to discuss the deep politicisation of the Border which the Good Friday Agreement and membership of the EU have brought about. Obviously, however, Brexit has brought the Border into sharp focus because, ultimately, the decision on what happens on the Irish Border is what is holding back the Brexiteers. They could have their dream of leaving the EU as we would not feel any of the infrastructure at the ports, but when we can see it on an island, and when the House of Commons Northern Ireland Affairs Committee is saying there are no technological solutions available other than the aspirational, then this frictionless and seamless border can be seen as wishful thinking.

On the issue of citizenship and citizenship rights, this was something the committee looked at in the context of imaginative solutions to the issue of Brexit for a report I prepared. The citizens of Northern Cyprus are treated as EU citizens even though they are in what Turkey classifies as being Turkey. Therefore, those who were born in Northern Cyprus enjoy rights that people who are from Turkey but living in Northern Cyprus do not enjoy, even though Northern Cyprus, while theoretically part of the EU, is not within its control, aligned with its customs arrangements or in its sphere. Its citizens are treated differently and, therefore, they have access to educational opportunities and so on. Those are the kinds of possible solutions we are looking at but the difficulty is they are all practical solutions whereas the problem is political. While they would be of huge benefit to citizens in Northern Ireland, including students who after Brexit could enjoy the benefits of education through the Erasmus programme, the politicians simply will not allow it even though they could get it, given Cyprus is a great example.