Pat Buckley (Cork East, Sinn Fein) | Oireachtas source

I welcome the witnesses. I had a number of questions but we will have to reverse back to the start. I do not know if the witnesses are aware that a motion on the duty of candour was discussed in the Chamber last night. It was about accountability, responsibility and transparency in the system and particularly in the HSE.

Listening to Deputies Neville and Rabbitte and a number of other speakers, it is like - and I have said this before - emptying the Red Sea with a bucket with no ass on it. Every time we come in here to ask questions, we do not get answers. I will go right back to the start. If this is something new that is supposed to change, as we have heard the Chairman say already, it is something old that changed to something new and that is back to something old again.

I will go back to what we call a duty of candour: responsibility, accountability, where the buck stops and whose name is at the end of the docket. My questions are very simple, and I would like if the witnesses could give me names in response because this is very important and they are the persons to whom we need to talk. First, who appointed them? I do not want to hear the Department of A, B, C or D; I need a name. Were these positions advertised? I need transparency on that. Was there an interview process? Were there decreases or increases in salaries or anything like that? Who carried out the whole process from start to finish? That is one little group of questions.

Going back to what Deputy Neville said a while ago about accountability and transparency and where the money is being spent on new services, I am sure the witnesses are right, but we are not seeing it at the front. Two weeks ago tomorrow I was in Clonmel. There were 300 people at the meeting, and to hear the stories of non-existent mental health services would absolutely break one's heart and soul. A 60 year old man has to find his own way from Clonmel to Kilkenny. While his paperwork - his own documents, his own life story - are being taxied from Clonmel to Kilkenny, he finds his own way. Once he was released from Kilkenny, he had to thumb his way back home. There is certainly something wrong when it comes to services. That is only one point. Mothers are revoking their sons' bail because the poor young fellas are safer in jail than being left out in Tipperary as the services are not there. It is not about who said what; the most important thing is that people around this country are really suffering. I am trying to be as polite and diplomatic about this as I can. As for the knock-on effect on each person and family of this, they are not statistics. They are human beings. I cannot reiterate this enough. There are schools where it is now normal for kids to hear every four to five weeks of another parent of a child dying by suicide. It is not the children.

There is a line in a recent reply Dr. Shari McDaid of Mental Health Reform received from Tony O'Brien about restructuring the establishment of the mental health division. Can any of the witnesses explain what the former head of the board meant when he said this?

Having developed a strong delivery system through the introduction of Community Healthcare Organisations and Hospital Groups, it is important that the role of the centre changes to one which supports and enables the delivery of services as opposed to actually delivering services.

This does not mention improvements or outcomes. It certainly does not mention patients. The point I am trying to make about this is that if we need to do something right, we must start right. This is not a personal attack on any of the witnesses. If they could answer those questions, I would be very happy. In the last paragraph on page 2 of Mr. O'Sullivan's opening statement, it states "to build a better health service and to strengthen governance and accountability in the service". I am not being disrespectful, but the majority of speakers that have spoken before me are not getting any answers. All I am getting is frustration. When it comes to figures and moneys, the increase in expenditure on mental health since 2013 is from €709 million to €867 million. If one were to do the maths, between 2013 and 2018, it is an increase of €1.32 million a year. Is that an overall increase within the mental health services or is that €1.32 million over the whole health service, after which the mental health section is pulled in? I am fairly confident in one of the CHOs from one of the budget reports that we did get that €447,000 was spent on taxi services in one area last year. There is no accountability, and €447,000 is a lot of money. I understand files can be transferred but, Janey Mac, it can surely be done some other way. It seems to be about spending money to make money for someone else. There is no such thing as spending money on the patients for a better outcome to save society stress and cost. Do the witnesses understand where I am coming from? I am frustrated. I would be very happy if they could answer my questions. I will be very disappointed if they cannot because, to be totally and brutally honest with them, if we cannot have accountability and transparency here, we are absolutely wasting our time.