Michael D'Arcy (Wexford, Fine Gael) | Oireachtas source

That is good. That is just a few bits and pieces. The Department of Finance is very proud of its long association with the national anthem, having acted as its unofficial custodian since it purchased the copyright of the music and the English lyrics of "The Soldier's Song" on behalf of the State in 1933. As a modest expression of our pride, Peadar Kearney was one of the figures we chose to honour recently when naming the various conference rooms and corridors off our main offices in Government Buildings. As such, I am glad of the opportunity to contribute to today's discussion. I sincerely hope the constructive engagement with the committee and the various stakeholders who have gathered here will result in a useful outcome for all concerned. To turn to the substance of today's discussion, I hope the written response to the consultative process that my Department has prepared for the committee has proven useful in setting out our position on the matter.

I will take this opportunity to highlight elements of our response concerning some of the specific questions raised by the committee in the consultation paper. The copyright of the music and English lyrics of the national anthem, held by Patrick Heaney and Peadar Kearney, respectively, was purchased by the Department of Finance on behalf of the State in 1933. Changes to copyright law meant it was purchased again in the same manner in 1965. In line with domestic and European copyright legislation, the State's claim to the copyright of the music and English lyrics of the national anthem expired on 31 December 2012. The original intention of purchasing the national anthem was to allow it to be freely played without the collection of royalties. This has remained the principled position of the Department throughout the period of its custodianship of the copyright. Upon its expiration on 31 December 2012, the Department felt that considering the anthem was in the public domain, that it was freely available and that fees could not be charged for its use, the original policy intent in purchasing the copyright appeared to have been satisfied, with "Amhrán na bhFiann" freely available to be used since 1 January 2013. This legal status is a common one internationally. Many countries, including the US, France and the Netherlands, allow their national anthems to reside in the public domain in this manner. In addition, I do not agree with the attempt to extend copyright of the national anthem to bring it back under the control of my Department.

Any such move would run contrary to both national and European copyright legislation. Last year, my Department received legal advice from the Attorney General on this issue that indicated that passing legislation to extend the State's copyright over the national anthem would not stand up to legal scrutiny. As such, the national anthem's current legal status is appropriate in regard to the original intention for the purchase of its copyright by the Department and in accordance with best practice internationally.

To turn to issues concerning the treatment of the anthem, I am fully aware and appreciate the important symbolism attached to it. It is one of the most important symbols of our State. It is an internationally recognised means of demonstrating our national pride, whether it is used for official State visits, to inspire sports people or to celebrate the wins of our athletes. Even its informal use across Ireland and around the globe serves to bring people of Ireland together. I am concerned, however, that several of the suggestions raised in the consultation document with the admirable purpose of protecting our anthem could, unfortunately, prove to be counterproductive. Despite the good intentions behind such suggestions, it could be argued that any attempts to restrict the anthem's use or introduce statutory penalties for its misuse could attract unnecessary attention and public ire. This could result in the anthem being disparaged or demeaned for political reasons or to make a point regarding free speech, particularly in regard to its use for parody or satire.

Given the symbolism attached to the national anthem, I fully understand and sympathise with the concerns of individuals pertaining to its general mistreatment or use in a derisory or disruptive manner. I believe, however, it is regularly treated with the appropriate respect. It goes without saying that the vast majority of Irish citizens have the utmost respect for it, while the instances of controversy concerning issues over recent decades have been few and far between. Since the anthem came out of copyright in 2012, there does not appear to have been any strong evidence of its use in a derogatory fashion, with both the court of public opinion and good sense of the people at large coming together to ensure this is the case.

It would be very difficult to define properly "inappropriate use of the anthem". It would be difficult for such restrictions to be constitutionally valid unless they were solidly justified and infringed as little as possible on freedom of expression rights. Similarly, I fully understand the desire that the national anthem not be used for commercial purposes. Given its symbolism and meaning to the Irish State and the majority of the citizens, the desire to prevent such a symbol being used to advance a commercial project or business is understandable, especially if it were to be used in a distasteful fashion. Of course, this is naturally subjective. Given my belief that the national anthem should remain within the public domain, I would not be in favour of any restrictions on its commercial use.

I am aware that there have been isolated incidents of its use for advertising purposes in recent years. Such incidents may indeed recur, but I must state once again my belief that the court of public opinion and general respect of the vast majority of citizens for the national anthem would be sufficient to discourage its use in this manner, especially given the potential for negative public reaction or a backlash against such use.

Defining what would constitute "commercial use" or "advertising purposes" would be very difficult. Doing so may have further unintended consequences, such as unduly restricting the use of the anthem in recordings made for charitable purposes. That is just one example. Nevertheless, while my issues with attempting to resolve these points in legislation are quite clear, I can certainly see the good intentions behind them. To this end, were consensus to emerge from the committee's deliberations that additional criteria are required to protect the national anthem, the suggestion that guidelines be prepared and published on its use would appear to be the most balanced approach to take at this juncture. Setting out the criteria for best practice on the suitable treatment of the national anthem and putting them on a more formal footing through official guidelines could have positive effects on future treatment. Such guidelines could take a similar form to those issued by the Department of the Taoiseach for the use of the national flag. They could contain non-binding protocols and suggested treatment for the anthem, with the aim of formally setting out the unofficial social conventions that are currently observed regarding it. If the text of such guidelines were to be agreed upon through an open process such as this, involving the range of relevant stakeholders this committee has invited to participate today, well-rounded and sensible criteria would emerge. These could consequently be considered by the Government for adoption as non-binding guidelines for the use of the anthem. The usefulness of this exercise could be complemented by incorporating an official designation of the Irish and English words and the sheet music of the anthem that can currently be found on the website of the Department of the Taoiseach as the accepted version of the national anthem.

I hope I have outlined my position on the national anthem and by Department's historical relationship with it. Generally attempting to extend the State's copyright over the national anthem is not legally feasible. Similarly, drafting legislation to give the anthem specific legal protections is an exercise that would be fraught with unnecessary risk and unintended consequences. The goodwill of the people by and large ensures our national anthem is treated with the respect it deserves. All national anthems deserve this as symbols of state. Drafting guidelines governing best practice for the use of the anthem in a variety of circumstances may help in ensuring this respect is codified, and such a document could be considered by the Government. Overall, I extend my goodwill to the members of the committee and wish them well in producing a final report.

As somebody who loves the history of our national emblems, I believe it is important we do not go too far on this. It is important that people be educated and informed about our national symbols and that they be prepared to gain knowledge of what the words of the national anthem actually mean and are not just proud because it is our anthem. It is important that they understand the symbolism and thought process behind our national anthem. The anthem was written in 1910 and translated in 1917, and it was subsequently understood to be our national anthem. The Irish translation became popularised. People should know and understand it.

I wish to touch on two final aspects. I am always concerned when people become too proud or attached to symbolism. It is not good. Sometimes people become overly nationalistic and fervently so. That is never good. There is a space in which one can show respect for the national anthem. I would like people to be in a space where they are informed and educated about it and know and understand its genesis and history.

Let me refer to the phrase "Fianna Fáil" in the first line of the anthem. My understanding is that this is the original translation. It should be left as it is and not changed to anything else. I am taking a very cold, objective view on this.

It is probably the GAA that has brought the national anthem to its current point. It is sung on All-Ireland day and provincial final days. Before television, it was heard on radio, played by the Artane Boys Band. People understand the music. The lyrics are rarely, if ever, sung on All-Ireland day. People understood the music before the words. I would like to push very strongly the view that people should understand the English words as much as the words as Gaeilge.