Mr. Kenneth Ruane:

-----when Mr. Barrett approached me there was certainly documentation. Mr. Barrett had a copy of the McGee report. Subsequent to that, Mr. Barrett had informed me that internal audit had never carried out any process on foot of that. There were a number of discussions where Mr. Barrett effectively confided the extent of what he had discovered in me. In terms of distinguishing what advice I gave as opposed to how I felt at the time, I certainly felt it was a significant and serious issue. If I can put it that way.