Mr. Conor O'Kelly:

In our position, borrowing more money is not a strategy that we would recommend. It is not really a good idea to borrow more money because interest rates are low. It is like saying to a household that it should go down to the bank and borrow more money, even though it has a big mortgage and credit card bills and a leased car in the driveway. That is the kind of situation we are in. It is difficult for us to suggest borrowing more money, even for capital spending, even though at some point the market will look more favourably on that. When our debt levels get down further in two, three or four years' time, that is going to become a legitimate option for us and the reaction from the market will probably be quite sanguine for capital investment. We are still just a bit too elevated for that.

There are the other parts of the NTMA that have a remit that is potentially more relevant - first of all the Ireland Strategic Investment Fund, ISIF. I was not around when the ISIF was set up but, to me, that was an enlightened legislation from the Oireachtas. On an international scale, the limitations of monetary policy are now becoming obvious to everybody. There is therefore a need for fiscal stimulus to be added, yet countries are already indebted. Ireland, through the creation of the strategic investment fund, having moved the mandate from the National Pensions Reserve Fund, NPRF, to focus on Ireland only, has a fiscal mechanism for investment that is pretty unusual. Many European countries are looking at that now with some degree of envy. It is a very powerful vehicle.

As the Deputy is aware, €2.6 billion has already been invested by the ISIF in a variety of investments across the country, creating 19,000 jobs - 60% of them outside of Dublin - in all sorts of sectors. Most importantly, as we always co-invest, the multiple of investment, which we expected to be twice what we put in, has turned out to be about 2.6 times. We are talking about €7.2 billion being invested because of the ISIF investment of €2.6 billion. It is an €8 billion fund which gives great capacity still; our pipeline of projects is about €2 billion in value. That investment can be targeted at infrastructure in all sorts of ways, depending on where the requirement is. Housing is obviously a big requirement. There is €550 million dedicated to housing. There are platforms like Activate Capital, Ardstone or the DCU campus. Some €54 million was put into a DCU accommodation campus by the ISIF, which released another €150 million from the European Investment Bank, EIB, for an overall campus development. That is the kind of impact and investment that can be made by the ISIF. We have a very powerful vehicle there.

Obviously, ISIF has to make off-balance-sheet investments, so it has to be commercial. We have a mandate to have what we call a double bottom line, that is, a commercial return plus economic impact. We work with investment partners and co-investors, which again helps keep our activities off-balance-sheet by demonstrating commercial capability.

The Minister has asked us to look at the housing area and social housing in particular. In the investments we have made so far, there is a pipeline of about 8,000 residential units which are being built and will be completed. There is potential for another 8,000 units in other platforms and investments that ISIF is currently considering. It is a long-term fund. Although the impact is not as immediate as any of us would like, the ISIF really can create long-term sustainable infrastructure investment to help solve some of those problems.