Mr. Jeremy Masding:

Let me respond to that. I think I was answering a different question, so if we go back to the point of principle, in June 2015 I announced the enforcement action and the redress and compensation scheme. I did that in a public way. I did not hide behind a press release. I did it in the boardroom of Permanent TSB in front of the Irish media. I then came to this House and answered questions, so in terms of the attitude and the remorse that the bank showed I hope that if Deputy Doherty looks back on the record for June 2015 he will see that I did not hide behind anything. I stood up there in front of the Irish media and apologised for the absolute distress that we caused to customers. I also was very clear that it would be irresponsible and completely without empathy if I tried to imply that the redress and compensation scheme would in all cases complete any remediation of any harm because obviously I do not know all the individual circumstances – Deputy Doherty might know better – but what we tried to do at the time was to design a scheme to the best of our ability to make sure that we did the right thing for customers, including those who suffered loss of ownership.

In terms of Deputy Doherty’s first point, I apologise if I gave the impression today that I was trying to deflect from what I did in 2015. I repeat my position to him that it was a sad episode in the history of the bank. We caused enormous detriment to a large number of customers. I apologised in person and we felt the scheme that we tried to design and build was the best scheme that we could do within the circumstances.

In terms of the second point about personal accountability, I repeat what I said at the time, namely, I have found no evidence to suggest that anyone within the group took a conscious decision to deprive customers of the trackers. If any such evidence emerges I will take the action that is appropriate.