Éamon Ó Cuív (Galway West, Fianna Fail) | Oireachtas source

It is not very clear in the statement made by Mr. Kavanagh. I appreciate the clarification. In respect of the issue of money, it seems to be a cheap shot. I cannot see how the harness racing people could be responsible for some debate that is going on as to who should fund the equine centre. In the heel of the hunt, if HSI is going to fund the equine centre, I presume the taxpayer and the Legislature must make the money available to it to do so because it has already made a pitch that it could develop its industry if it had more money. What this committee is looking at in the round is whether more money should be invested in horses of all types here. It is one of the issues we are looking at but I am not sure how relevant it was to the IHRA issue.

I would be very interested in one practical question. If I brought horses into a place and if no horses were entering that place for a week or a fortnight, what steps would I have to take to make sure there was no transmission of disease? Would it relate mainly to the dung that would left behind? I understand that a lot of disease is transmitted by physical contact or proximity. Allowing for a fortnight, a week or ten days apart or whatever time the experts would say, is it possible to ensure that one really minimises disease transmission risks by, for example, disposal of all dung? I would be interested in hearing the views of the expert witnesses in front of us today on how this issue might be dealt with or how high that risk is. In other words, is there a significant risk at different times and on different dates compared to other risks in the industry? I am sure the Irish Equine Centre would be able to give some information on that because, presumably, it has a risk analysis concerning the cross-transmission of disease. Horse Racing Ireland told us it has it, but it is not telling us what they are telling it. I hope that before we finalise the report in January, we can get a detailed breakdown from the equine centre of where it sees the risks of cross-contamination and how it would measure them. It is like all human activity. One thing we must start doing is measuring risk, because somebody could tell you every day that something is high risk. The only way we can do it is by calculating it scientifically and mathematically and asking, if one were taking insurance out on an actuarial basis, how they would rate the various risks, how they would eliminate the risks and where they would prioritise the elimination of risks. When we come to that issue, we need that kind of scientific and analytical approach to it. That would be much more constructive for all of us than a more emotional approach.

I am very interested in what was said about the impact on the race track, because a fantastic solution has been proposed. There are two major horse racing meetings in Galway, which has a fantastic track and a fantastic location on the edge of the city. In fairness to the greyhound people, they always benefit from horse racing and run greyhound races, because people are people. There are fantastic facilities at the back of the stand that could be used for concerts in the summer, similar to the Milwaukee festival. Like the RDS, it is hard to see a facility like that down for the rest for the year. Horse Racing Ireland seem to be telling us that if we put tracks inside the tracks, we could use them for harness racing at different times of the year. On the other hand, we would be sharing the stands, toilets, catering facilities, car parking and all the other fantastic facilities that all of these places have. Let us be honest about it. Most of the time, they are very under-utilised when one stacks up the number of events and the facilities in most places. Even places such as Ballinrobe are used for the agricultural show in the summer. I am not sure whether they bring in sport horses in on that particular day.

The issue of veterinary standards goes back to the Irish Equine Centre. We need to involve the Irish Equine Centre. I think we all agree that veterinary standards should be the same, but my understanding is that, in terms of the actual day, one is looking at the premise that this is in hand.

In respect of fixture flexibility, I go back to the Croke Park analogy. I presume that conventional horse races on Horse Racing Ireland tracks, which were built for conventional horse racing, would take priority. I do not think the harness racing people were complaining about that. The flexibility relates to when they are not in use. If facilities were built, I do not think they would have any problem finding plenty of days and plenty of seasons where no conventional horse racing is taking place.

Mr. Kavanagh mentioned legislation. Could he spell it out for us? We can always change the legislation. If there are issues relating to legislation, it would be a good idea to know exactly they are. Perhaps we need to change the definitions. People seem to think that legislation is immutable. If we need to redefine racing, we can do so very easily by bringing in a one-line amendment to a number of Bills. The 2001 Act was mentioned. There is no problem with amending the Act. Horse Racing Ireland just needs to tell us what we need to do to sort out that problem for it and we will willingly do it. I do not think legislation should be seen as the major bugbear, because we can deal with that as legislators. We do not know whether all of us will be legislators after the election, but those who take over from us will be able to look at that issue. Direct negotiations between harness racing authorities in Ireland and France are matters for negotiation and if necessary, legislative change. They are practical issues. The point was made that it would take seven years to move forward.

We need to take all the issues raised and look at them analytically. I hope Horse Racing Ireland can start the process by giving us the information I requested today so that, over the Christmas period, we can look at it in conjunction with our report. Unfortunately, most of us are not banking on being here after 30 January 2016 in this session of the Dáil, and we would like to get our horse report out by then. Perhaps we could get all of this information between now and Christmas Day. It would inform us in writing our report. I take the view that all sports, activities and things people want to do should be facilitated within reason. I might favour some sports over others but I do not want to deny anybody else the right to enjoy sports that I might not favour. We must recognise that there seems be some interest in harness racing.

They seem to be very committed to it and to be willing to adhere to the highest standards. We concur fully with HRI that we need the highest standards, given that we have a very valuable industry. I ask Mr. Bolger to outline how valuable the non-thoroughbred horse sport industry in Ireland is and the number of people involved in it nationally when one takes into account the special breeds and all the rest who are turning over a few euro there. Am I right in thinking that top show jumpers, which we have not, unfortunately, produced in the quantity we should have, given our natural advantage, are worth very significant sums of money internationally? Mr. Bolger might indicate to the committee what a top show jumper would be worth on the market? What is the value of a top show jumper that would win the Olympics or a similar competition? Mr. Bolger might give us a sense of that and the size of his industry. Our view in the committee has been that while the thoroughbred industry is incredibly important and nothing must be done to damage it, the sport industry reaches out to many and puts a few euro in many pockets and that should also be developed significantly. Money should be provided to that sector to develop also.