Richard Boyd Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, People Before Profit Alliance) | Oireachtas source

I do not agree with the Deputy on certain issues at all, although I agree on some matters. At a basic level, there are people who are working but who cannot afford to pay rent. There are civil and public servants coming to my office who cannot pay rent and who are using homeless services or sleeping in cars. When that is happening, regardless of ideology, every single bit of available relief should go to helping such people.

Let us forget about ideology, philosophy and incentivising people at the top. I maintain there is simply no justification for giving to those on €70,000, €80,000, €100,000 or more in this way. Whatever else one may say about those people, they can pay the bills. They are not in danger, for the most part, of losing their homes. However, the vast majority of people on low pay are in a situation where they are actually having difficulty keeping roofs over their heads.

We have this problem and it is getting worse. The take-home pay of people is insufficient to cover the bills and keep a roof over their heads. Against that background, does the Minister not accept that he simply must engineer tax changes such that every cent is directed at bringing that group up to the point where they are not coming home after a week's work unable to pay to keep a roof over their heads? Whatever way the Minister wants to do it is fine - I do not care. It is self-evident that we should do this and, against that background, what the Minister has done is simply not good enough.

The Minister may argue that he has capped the benefits that may have accrued otherwise. I accept the Minister has done that, but in the current scenario whereby we have the phenomena of the working poor, far more radical measures are necessary, and I do not believe they are contained in the budget.

Does the Minister recognise the connection between growing wage differentials among top earners and low and average earners? That gap is growing all the time. It is connected to growth in inequality generally and wealth inequality in particular. Any serious studies undertaken on the subject confirm that the wage and salary hierarchy contributes over time to a growing gap between rich and poor. In other words, if a person earns €100,000 or €150,000 per year, he need not spend all of it to stay alive. The person can save and invest. That money makes profit for him and it accumulates over time. By contrast, the person on low income who has to borrow to pay the bills or do most things is getting poorer on a cumulative basis over time. Wage differentials contribute to growing wealth inequality. There is a significant if not a majority consensus now to the effect that the wealth inequality flowing from income inequality is one of the biggest problems we face. This is clearly evident in Irish society, just as it is a pattern throughout the world. In approaching budgets, we should seek to address that and rebalance things. We should have taxes that are redistributive, Robin Hood taxes, if I can put it that way. They should take from the rich to give to the poor because the gap is too big.

I will offer an obvious example. The Minister might hold that we have to incentivise the man at the top, for example, a banker, who may be on €500,000 per year or more. I struggle to see why a banker should get paid ten times or 11 times what a nurse gets paid. Is it because of the length of hours worked or the level of responsibility? I am afraid I see no great difference in that regard. Arguably, the nurse is doing far more of a service than the banker. I do not see how one can justify a differentiation by a factor of ten between what one and the other earns. Perhaps the Minister disagrees with that, but I struggle to see the justification.

Against that background, if I were Minister for Finance, I would hold that we need a tax system which at least reduces the gap in net income between those two groups because it has grown spectacularly. Moreover, it contributes in the macro sense to a growing gap in wealth inequality. It is summed up by some of the biggest billionaires in this country who at this point make money because they have money. Do we not need to do something about that? Is there not something wrong with that? Let us suppose a person has €1 billion. He can add to his personal wealth, probably by 5% per year or perhaps 10%, not because he works longer hours or because he is more educated but simply because he has a great deal of money to start with. Any fair approach to taxation would recognise that there is something wrong with the idea that people get richer simply because they are rich while other people who are working their backs off are struggling to pay the bills. Is that not correct?

I put those points to the Minister. I can guess what the answer will be. Nonetheless I believe these are serious issues which are not being addressed. In fact, I believe they are not even recognised by the Government as issues that need to be addressed. A growing chorus of voices maintains that these gaps between rich and poor in terms of income and wealth have to be addressed for the sake of justice and for the sake of macroeconomic stability as well.