Willie Penrose (Longford-Westmeath, Labour) | Oireachtas source

I thank Mr. Comer for coming here today and for not reading out his presentation verbatim. At least he presented it without reading through it. We could all do that.

I am somewhat surprised. Twelve months ago I sat here and warned people. I was an agricultural consultant for many years and met many farmers. I warned dairy farmers to be wary of what was about to happen. I cautioned them very strongly. I know a couple of farmers who got into dairy. I warned other farmers who were thinking of changing that unless they won the lotto, they should not do so. Therefore, I am somewhat surprised by the delegation's attitude. Farmers are very cautious, as I know from having a brother who is a farmer. Since farmers are so cautious, somebody must have encouraged them. I did not hear a farming organisation saying "stop". As individuals, we have to take some responsibility as well.

The banks were before us, as was the Irish Dairy Board. They predicted this. They spoke about the circumstances in New Zealand, China and the Middle East in addition to the Russian ban. I left the committee that morning saying one would want to be a right fool to believe this would be a gold rush. Perhaps I am a very cautious person but if I were leaving here after having listened to the presentations, I would have said "stop". One is dealing with a perishable commodity where one is forced into the market and one is depending on processors to give the best price.

At the time in question, there were discussions about the superlevy bill being approximately €100 million. Reference was made to the appeals system and all that followed. The year 2014, especially the early part, was fairly good. Good prices were achieved and there was good production. Now the tax bill has to be faced. If one is in the Revenue Commissioners' online service, ROS, one has another few days. If not, one had to go the other day. Those are the circumstances that arise. There was a collapse in the milk price, which was predicted. Unless I am wrong, the Irish Dairy Board indicated there would be a significant drop. It was hoping there would be a recovery in 2016. I recall this vividly.

Farmers have become more efficient and effective and are promoting later lactation and an increase in milk solid constituents. That is perfect at this time of the year. Things work like that. There is a dilution when one goes into the milk season. It is related to the mixed production of grass. We now have good weather and everything else. I am not surprised the figures indicate we are galloping ahead at such a pace that the 2020 target will be reached two years early. We have taken many steps, including through cow conditioning, dealing with culled cows and getting rid of certain things. The efficiency factors are certainly being focused upon by farmers in a very positive way.

Regarding the issue which I agree is important, I disagree with Senator O'Neill that the wiping out and abolition of quotas at one stroke might bring about what was referred to. It was affecting the whole market. We are a small player in the market. One could see what was going to happen.

I believed the banks would be cautious. Has there been a high level of borrowing? The banks pointed out that there were a considerable number of farmers with very little borrowed at the time. Has there been a high level of borrowing since then? As Deputy Deering suggested, the figure might be possible to obtain. What degree of leniency are the banks offering farmers? The banks are great at, as it were, putting their arms around one's shoulder to get one in. However, when one experiences a bit of trouble, are banks appropriately lenient by giving an interest-free period and not levying people with significant inputs?

We have had the retailers before the committee. As Chairman of a previous enterprise committee, I was the first person to produce a report in this regard. The retailers would not even tell us their margins. I am not surprised, therefore, that the ICMSA cannot get the margins. Some of the retailers just dismissed us out of town altogether.

We produced a good report. Deputy Doyle, as Chairman of this committee, has another excellent report. We all know where that is. The farmer, as primary producer, gets whatever is left on the table. The retailers take everything. The middle men and the retailers are in there. The farmer carries the load and they take the profits. Particularly at this time, they have a role to play.

I agree with the witness. I recommended at the time that we should have legislation with teeth instead of puffy legislation with different elements. The legislation should confer proper investigative powers. This was shunted to the Competition Authority, but that was a waste of time; where would people get the evidence? No more than in any other industry, who would come forward? That was a waste of time. We have stepped back from bringing forward legislation with teeth, which is regrettable. The president is right in stating that it is probably easier to do this at a European level. Let us do that in an umbrella process.

I know the dairy forum made some progress, especially for younger farmers, which is accepted and welcome, but the ICMSA and Macra na Feirme are speaking about the possibility of an income bond being put in place to cover valley periods between decent returns. That must be examined. It is no use to say this has not been done before. It is a very useful tool and it can be used at a time of reduced prices and consequent income volatility, which we are now experiencing. This will recur, as it happened six years ago; it could happen in four, five, six or seven years again. There is a cycle to this. I support the ICMSA very strongly in that, as it is very useful, innovative and welcome. We should not be afraid to explore ideas that have not been tried before in other areas. There are peculiarities in farming that are not present in other types of industry.

I recall that the other prediction was that in 2016 things would start going back up for farmers, and the dairy sector in particular, as it is on its knees now. Taking Dr. Dillon's projections into account, one would need to be very cute to survive the next 12 months. Unless there is a significant intervention, many people will find it hard to survive, and it becomes even more pressing if there is a family involved because of the other commitments. One must also take into account unexpected or unanticipated events in farming, as it is no different from any other walk of life.

This is an extremely important area for the committee. There is much downstream activity with regard to employment that must be acknowledged, not just on the farm but all over the place. It is very important for rural Ireland. With that said, I will support the witnesses in any way I can.