Mr. Fintan Drury:

Anglo was disinterested at the top level, where decisions like that are made in organisations, Anglo was disinterested in engaging with politics, in engaging with politicians, and ... to the ... certainly in respect of the former chief executive who became chairman, the level of disinterest was acute. So in all my time, both as a consultant, Deputy, in the '90s and then later as a non-executive director of the bank, and with the greatest respect to everybody in this room, I never came across, or I rarely came across an institution that I worked with, or had an engagement with in Ireland, that was less interested in politics and less interested in lobbying, or less interested in engaging with the body politic.