Mr. Alan Merriman:

That was ... that was '06-'07. The board came up with a very considered view. It went through the detailed analysis and it came up with a very considered view, "No, we're not selling out, we want to stay mutual, we're going to make it work. Management, we want you to make this work. You've a mandate to go and make it work." So we put ... we'd had that debate. I wasn't the bad loser. I accepted the board's decision. And what the strategy then was about was trying to preserve mutuality as best we could. So there weren't battles going on in the boardroom in '08.