Mr. Sean Mulryan:

Well, it was '92 when we done our first joint venture with Nationwide - 700 houses in Lucan. And that model started from where Nationwide would be a partner.

So, Nationwide would put up all the money, charge an interest rate of about 2.5% over the Libor and - which would be normal banking - and then, for taking ... putting up all of the capital, they would take 50% of the profits. And that model was extraordinarily successful for them and then we moved forward. So, we done the 700 houses in Lucan, then we moved to London. They done, continuously, projects ... on the same basis, the same model, and right through into the 2000s. We done many, many projects on that model and from Nationwide's point of view, it was hugely successful. They not alone got their interest rate, they made a lot of profit, and, even, right up to right now, with the ... the loans being transferred to, to NAMA, there isn't one Nationwide joint venture that hasn't made a profit on the par debt, over the par debt, in that 20, 21, 22.