Mr. Bertie Ahern:

Well, as we know now, there was, so it's no good denying that. But the position, Chairman, at the time, and I know your committee knew ... I've heard you several times saying you're anxious to know what the state of mind was at the time, and what the state of mind is now. But if I could give you at the time: at the time was 30% of unsustainable taxes was too high, but the proportion of what we believed would be sustainable was something building about 30,000 ... 55,000 houses. And it was ... if you take it that roughly 1% per 10,000 houses, we were talking about an adjustment, on the budgetary side, of 3%, or maybe 3.5%, which we believed was totally sustainable, and that the employment effect would have put up employment up to 7%. And what I've said in my statement, not to dwell on it, but what the ESRI pointed out, where they saw the vulnerabilities, and they were quite critical, and a very good organisation, and their independence I accept and admire and worked under for many years, but they looked at what the period was by 2005 to 2010, and 2010 to 2015, and they were looking at even a less tough hit. So if you follow your own logic, Chairman, if I can respect-----