Mr. Brendan McDonagh:

The Secretary General of the Department of Finance, who I met at the NTMA advisory committee boards or committee meetings, I outlined the position on counter-party credit limits ... was very well aware of our position. And, in terms of what discussion happened between Dr. Somers and the Minister, I wasn't privy to them. I had only met Minister Cowen once, fleetingly in, I think, it was in July 2014 ... 2004, when he was made Minister for Finance he came to Treasury Buildings to meet Dr. Somers. Dr. Somers brought him around the floor and I met him for about ten seconds. And I never met Mr. Cowen again after that. So-----