Mr. Brian Cowen:

But the point I was going to make, Chairman, is that the NTMA ... the view of the NTMA was expressed by Mr. Cardiff in the room. Physically, the chief executive and the deputy chief executive were out ... over in America. He had been trying to contact the gentleman in question and he arrived ... you know, he got there as quickly as he could, he got there at half nine, or whenever it was.

Mr. Cardiff has explained the situation from then on as to why he didn't feel it was necessary for anyone else to come into the room at that point. And when there was a query or a clarification sought, the now chief executive of NAMA was available to give clarification.