Mr. Kevin Cardiff:

I'm trying to remember timeframes. I think they were at that time. Anglo might have had a brief period when it wasn't really, earlier on, but it was covered by periods of ... well, they were solvent in the sense that it was always the case that the State would stand behind them, so they could only then be insolvent ... and when I mentioned Anglo, there was a moment when, you know, there was ... the State had to say, "Yes, in fact we are behind them" to make sure that they remained solvent." And then your ... the next question would be, if the State is insolvent, how would its credit make the banks solvent? But the State wasn't insolvent, the State was, as has proved to be the point ... proved to be the case, the State was capable of adjusting in such a way as to come out of the ... of its problems provided it had a supply of funding, which came from the EU-IMF programme.