Mr. Kevin Cardiff:

Okay, well, Deputy, I'm assuming that somewhere in your system you've received copies of my jotter which deal with these also. So, this was a note of a meeting but it was based on my jotter and my jotter didn't just say "8½", it actually broke it down into numbers that I can't ... I don't remember the detail. But ... so I'm pretty sure that, yes, that was definitely said and it's down beside Dave Doyle in my jotter so I've checked back in it ... it seems like it was him but, yes, in the confusion of a meeting, maybe someone else said it, but it was said. "After capital" was my recollection of it when I wrote this note. Now, at the end, I should ... maybe I should've put this in the note too but the very next page of my jotter, it says, "Merrill Lynch says, 'This is all finger in the air stuff, we just don't know.'" I think what was happening, to be honest, is that people were testing assumptions, as you would expect them to do. Trying to say, you know, if X was so much worse, then Y could happen - that kind of thing. At the end of the meeting, I'm sure ... and I'm sure that later in the month, we did not have a view ... none of the official bodies had a view that these banks were insolvent at that point.