Michael Fitzmaurice (Roscommon-South Leitrim, Independent) | Oireachtas source

I thank Mr. Gleeson for his presentation.

A few months ago I used the analogy of an apple high up in a tree to describe the programme, which means it will be hard to attain. As much as 70% of the suckler herd is located in the west of Ireland in a region that spans the country from County Clare all the way up to County Donegal.

People were frightened when they received a letter with red writing which referred to clawing back the money.

Why has the Department decided on an environmental scheme? Under the previous system the calf was weaned before it was sent to the mart and the farmer had to fulfil certain criteria before he was paid. I know one answer. In an era of world trade, one cannot subsidise production. This was not a subsidy but a means of ensuring that the animal for export would be in better condition and would not contract pneumonia.

I query the Department's figure of €30,000 because I can tell everybody that all the farmers who talk to me are pulling out of this scheme. The average size of a herd is 12 cows. The proposed scheme is not worth the hassle for producers.

I know Mr. Gleeson has stated that the cost of genotyping will be in line with what it cost last year, but we have heard the Minister say in the past month that the contract will go to tender and the price will come down to approximately €18. Previously it cost €30. Are Mr. Gleeson and the Minister on two different wavelengths or are they basing the reduction on the whole herd?

The ICBF has no statistics on all the calves that are exported to Italy and England. We are relying on farmers to feed good food to the animals they sell. If one sells animals that have not been fed well, it will come back when the animals are killed as the quality of the cow will not be good.

An issue that we will need to consider in the next three or four years is the general configuration of the animal. Not so long ago the heifers that a farmer brought to the mart could either be put in calf or killed for meat. Now we are going down a road whereby the heifers will be classified and those with one to three stars will be sent to the meat factory. We are walking into a situation in which we are putting the farmers into the hands of the meat factory once more. When the Scottish farmers came to buy animals, they judged the animal and bought black heifers. Some of them might not have been classified as four or five star animals, but they were good cattle. I think the way this scheme is put together will play into the hands of the dairy sector. I was at one of the meetings on the maternal scheme where a farmer who had Charolais bulls and cows was told straight out that he would probably have to change breeds. We are choosing to go for a narrow-arsed animal. We are deciding to go for the animals produced for the dairy sector, which will play into the hands of that sector.

There is a fear about entering a six-year cycle to produce a greener animal, an animal that will grow faster and die sooner. It is expected that everything will be hunky dory. What if the system does not work out in five years' time? I have warned that if the proposal does not work out the farmer could face a penalty. I invite Mr. Gleeson to put himself in the situation of a farmer who goes with this scheme and finds that after five years it has not worked out and then he is told that all the money he has received will be clawed back. Somebody from the unions would be jumping and hopping if this were to happen to officials, but the farmer gets kicked every time.

I know the bulls that come in from France or other European countries are just one star or two star animals. The EU is great for telling farmers right around Europe what to do, but there is no joined-up thinking on bulls bred in England, France or elsewhere to make sure that farmers have accurate information on the calibre of the animal. Farmers have judged cattle down through the years and can evaluate them based on their experience. There has been no consultation whatsoever with the ordinary farmer. The ICBF and the Department have come up with this rushed scheme. Everybody welcomes the money - nobody is saying that the money is not welcome - but the level of fear means that farmers will walk away from it. That is a very sad thing.