Mr. Liam O'Reilly:

You know at this stage, I think from looking at earlier, there was a process, the process was that, at the end of the day, it was the ... the budget and remuneration committee that decided on ... on staff numbers. And my abiding memory of that was that there were times when we had not filled our complement and the board said, ''Well, how can we say you need any more when you haven't even got what you asked for in the first place?''