Ciarán Lynch (Cork South Central, Labour) | Oireachtas source

No, no, what Mr. Daly is implying is the exposure that your practice actually created. It's not that you're giving a few bob to an SME here, or a video shop here, or a health club here. What you were doing was giving compound lending into one sectoral area, one loan after another, after another, that led to an exposure. So a developer built the shopping centre, the equity value in that - no cash transaction - maybe increased by 20%. That 20% then - no cash transference - was used as a notional concept to securitise a new loan to build another development. This was all construction. This wasn't SMEs, this wasn't some guy setting up some carpet shop down the road, these were developing loans that ultimately resulted in all these major borrowers having to go into NAMA with massive loans that your bank had provided. So this is an exposure issue. And what Mr. Daly is indicating in his statement - and Mr Daly may well be back before the committee and we'll get further clarification from himself, and we may call other witnesses back as well - is that the business model operated by banks was creating an exposure in property without any down payment or cash being made. The securitisation was notional equity. Does that reflect the business model that AIB were using? And did it create an exposure?