Mr. Dermot Gleeson:

Well I mean ... I can't remember what precise steps I took on a day in, the date again, June 2006. That is nine years ago. But, here I think it was being drawn to our attention and the "we" of course speaks for the whole organisation. We got regular updates. The group internal audit would review the property book. The chief risk officer ... remember the way we managed risk in AIB was this. There were three principles to do with risk management, just three. One, the risk is owned by the business. If you are the credit card person you own those business risks. Two, the risk function set-up under the man from JP Morgan, is an independent function to scrutinise the observance of risk management on behalf of the board. And that is what we depended on. I know that sounds like an excuse but that ... you couldn't ... I couldn't go around and check it. That was the system that we operated and the risk section was never refused resources. Whatever it needed to do their part of it, the second part. To look at the business end of it and to manage the risk on their ... to monitor the risk on their behalf.