Mr. Simon Carswell:

That is the difficulty. We do not know exactly the contacts that were made and I made reference to quasi-social occasions in my opening statement. We do not know exactly the interactions that take place but we know they are close. As a journalist I was always interested in this and I tried to get into Fianna Fáil's Galway tent, for example, and I got in one time and I saw it. I saw the close contact between the people they had invited or donors, whoever they were, and various Government Ministers. What struck me at the time was, "I wonder what they are talking about." We do not know. That is the problem. The lobbying that we do know is often found out through freedom of information requests to Government Departments. The media, and certainly I, as a reporter trying to find out more, would be constantly hitting walls trying to find out exactly the relationships between these people and what it means in terms of forming policy on certain issues and it is not at all transparent.