Aideen Hayden (Labour) | Oireachtas source

I welcome the Minister of State, Deputy Dara Murphy. It is very good that we have an opportunity to explore the Irish Government's perspective on this issue at a reasonably early stage in the process. As the Minister of State said, there is no other country that would be as affected by a potential British exit as Ireland would be. That is true for a number of reasons, not least of which is that we are a small open economy on the periphery of Europe. Britain is also an island nation. We have the same peripheral interests, to some extent. Maybe the centre of power in Europe has shifted to further to the east than it was when we joined. Apart from anything else, it is very important for us that Britain stay in the EU because it is a friend, colleague and ally, is also an English-speaking country, also comes from a common law tradition and shares many of the same interests as Ireland. In that context, it is worth mentioning the common border, the North-South issue, trade, and all the other matters the Minister of State has mentioned. Does the Irish Government want a referendum in the UK? We know the political realities. The Conservative Party has indicated that it will have a referendum. The Labour Party has indicated that if there is any move towards a closer Europe, it will put a referendum to the British people. Ultimately, there is a likelihood that there will be a referendum in the UK, regardless of whether this happens today, tomorrow, two years from now or four years from now.

I looked briefly at the paper submitted by Mr. Brendan Halligan. I would like to pick up on an interesting comment he made. I would have some sympathy with his view that Britain's half-in-half-out relationship with the EU over the last decade is not particularly helpful for the future of the EU. It can be argued that it would not necessarily be any harm, in the wider European interest and potentially in our own interest, to draw a line under this. That would enable all of us to move on with the European project, regardless of whether that project is moving towards a closer Union or perhaps towards a less close Union, as some of the proposed British reforms would be indicate. I suppose that is my first question. Does the Irish Government have a view on whether we want this matter to be concluded by means of referendum? If we want it to be concluded in that way, do we want it to be concluded sooner or later? Is there a cost associated with all of this indecision over a period of time? If so, is it a cost to the UK and not necessarily to us? Do we have a particular view on this?

We are all aware that there is a shopping list in terms of the UK renegotiation. The Minister of State mentioned some of the items on that list. Could he expand on his understanding of what the items on that shopping list are? He indicated that we would be prepared to assist the UK with certain matters on its agenda, but perhaps not with others. He suggested that we might not have much sympathy with the UK's freedom of movement concerns, for example. I suggest that those concerns relate not to freedom of movement per sebut to some people's freedom of movement for the purposes of welfare tourism. I refer to the idea of people being entitled to benefits in the UK without ever having worked in that country or earned social protection stamps or other benefits there. Could the Minister of State outline what he understands the shopping list to be? Which items on that list do we have sympathy with? Which items do we have no sympathy with? If the Minister of State answers by saying it is a developing concept I will understand, but it would be good if he could give any indication in this regard.

I would like to ask the Minister of State about our position on any renegotiation of the UK's membership of the EU. Clearly, much of the work on any renegotiation will be done in advance of any potential UK exit, if that is what happens. Does the Minister of State genuinely think there is any real recognition among our European colleagues of our particular interest in this? It does not seem to me, on the basis of some of this committee's discussions in the UK, that there is an understanding at this early stage of the debate of the real impact this would have on Ireland as a nation. I know we are small beans in terms of the UK's overall consideration. In the Minister of State's opinion, how much understanding of Ireland's position exists at this point, not only within the UK but within the wider EU? Is there an appreciation of how important it would be to us if the UK were to leave the EU? Is it understood that we would need special consideration? It concerns me that there seems to be a view abroad that we will go back to business as it was before by negotiating a free trade agreement with the UK. It is being suggested that we will have our own special little arrangement. There does not seem to be a wider understanding that we cannot do that. It is no longer open to us because any arrangement with the UK would have to be made via the EU bloc of countries. How hopeful is the Minister of State that there would be an understanding of our position in such circumstances, and that a special accommodation could be reached? I apologise for asking so many questions.