Oireachtas Joint and Select Committees

Thursday, 26 February 2015

Joint Oireachtas Committee on European Union Affairs

Possible Exit of UK from European Union: Discussion (Resumed)

2:00 pm

Professor Imelda Maher:

I was aware that the Swiss had a successful referendum and that this would have implications for relations with the EU. I do not know what those implications are. The Union cannot ignore a democratic vote. I am not sure how it will play out domestically in the Swiss context. One would hope that the UK will learn from this. The relationship is complex. One cannot operate exclusively within a domestic context because we are interdependent, and that has to be factored in. One of the dilemmas in the debate in the UK is the inability to embrace that interdependency beyond the UK.

The question of common law and civil law is one of the first things a common law student learns. What I hear in the Deputy's question in part is a question about whether we, as common lawyers, are being precious. I have sympathy for that view but, on the other hand, a basic example of how they differ is that judges in many civil law countries are civil servants and, therefore, their entire status and their relationship with the state is different from what it is in the common law system, under which there is no question that they are in any way integrated into the administrative structures of the state in that way. That is a fundamental distinction, and that is why, as I understand it, Ireland did not sign up for the European Investigation Order - because it would have allowed for direct contact between judges, which would not be appropriate at all and which would be incoherent in a common law system. We should not overplay the card, as my colleague suggested, but, none the less, there are moments at which the differences are profound, and we need to be mindful of that.

I was asked what a mini Schengen agreement would look like. The MOU on the visa that has come in is a big step towards that.

The common travel area had no law at all for a while. Sometimes it is a good thing to have no law and one does not always have to have rules. Helpful guidelines that allow for great flexibility can be perfectly satisfactory. However, the moment comes when these things have to be reviewed and politics dictate a need for greater certainty. In respect of the CTA, that moment has arrived.

The ECHR is mentioned in the Good Friday Agreement. If the UK walks away from the ECHR there is a very serious problem to be addressed.

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