Jim Daly (Cork South West, Fine Gael) | Oireachtas source

I thank the witness for taking the time to appear before the committee and apologise for the sideshow that came between us for a while. I thank them for their patience in staying the course. We appreciate their input. I also thank the Chairman and the secretariat for facilitating the meeting.
The issue of boards of management has been a bugbear of mine for some time and I have been trying to get it onto the agenda of the committee. I come at it from a different perspective from what all the witnesses have submitted. I appreciate that we are dealing with voluntary bodies and that their time is their own. We owe an enormous debt of gratitude to members who populate boards of management. I honestly believe that boards of management are one of the last bastions of Irish society on which a light needs to be shone, and a very strong light needs to be shone on some of the activities in a limited number of cases. There are certainly cases that I as a public representative have come across about which I am greatly concerned. The difficulty with boards of management in primary schools in particular is that they are not accountable to anybody, so far as I can ascertain. I accept the submission from the Department of Education and Skills that the Minister can effectively dissolve a board of management, but when has that happened? Is there any example in which that has happened?
I have followed with interest cases in which parents have had issues with boards of management. God help us all, and the parent involved, if he or she tries to take on a board of management, because effectively they are a law onto themselves. Boards of management are entities that are wholly, totally and completely answerable to themselves alone. When a board of management works well it is all great and good, and we all acknowledge the volunteerism. When it goes wrong and when a decision is made in which a parent is wronged, or something happens that is not favourable to the parent, there is no avenue for that parent to get recompense or to seek justice vis-à-visthe decision of a board of management.
There are examples of boards of management all over the country in which the chairperson is in situfor 20-plus years and in which members of the board appointed by the patron are in situfor 20, 30 or sometimes up to 40 years. I come to this as a former school principal. I was secretary of a board and a member of numerous boards at second level, particularly during my time in County Cork Vocational Education Committee. Just to focus on primary schools, the effective role and function of a school board of management is to rubber-stamp the decisions of the principal and to provide cover for the principal. That is how it operates on a day-to-day basis. Everybody has a hands-off attitude because they are volunteers. We need to look at that issue, and that is what this meeting is about. I wish to bring a focus to it.
I am aware of one case, which I brought to the attention of the former Minister, Deputy Ruairí Quinn, in which there is more than €100,000 owing to a supplier of goods and services by a board of management. The supplier cannot get these moneys despite their having been paid to the board of management. There is an issue here when something goes wrong, and that is what I am trying to get at. I am not trying to undermine the work, the volunteerism and the spirit with which the vast majority operate. Recently there has been emphasis on boards such as that of Rehab. Boards of management will have to come under a similar regime. We have to wake up and smell the coffee and, as a society, look at the real issue.
I have been in contact with the Ombudsman and have had many dealings with him to ascertain whether the actions of boards of management can be investigated. I have also checked with the Department, its Secretary General, the Minister and the patron, and I have exhausted all avenues trying to find out where one can go with a complaint, be it legitimate or perceived, but everybody passes one around and one finds that ultimately the board of management, in its constitution, is entitled to do what it wants. If it demands that a child should come to school standing on its head, in reality there is very little place to go with that type of complaint afterwards. I will give an example. Most primary school principals will use the good offices of the INTO for advice on school boards of management. The INTO membership took offence at the JobBridge scheme introduced by the Government a couple of years ago. Is there any one board of management across the length and breadth of the country that stated it was responsible for the decision as to who worked in its school and taught its children? The point was made earlier that the constituent members do not represent their constituency. However, a principal will tell a board of management that the INTO is against JobBridge and the board will back off straight away and agree not to take on anybody under the JobBridge scheme or allow any student teacher into its school. That is proof positive that what I am talking about is a problem, unless anybody can give me an example in which a board of management did what it was supposed to do and looked at the wider interests of the school and the greater representation, not just those of the INTO members. That is an example of a situation, of which there are many, in which boards of management are toothless and are just providing cover where something goes wrong. In his contribution, Mr. Fennelly referred to the old days of the parish priest as manager. We are still in the old days of the parish priest as manager but we are also in the old days of the principal as manager. My experience for the most part is that the principal says this is how it is and the board will rubber-stamp it.
I have a couple of questions for the Department as I seek to move the debate on. What is the position with the enactment of section 28, under which people can appeal decisions of boards in respect of admissions and so on? What is the position with the parents' charter? I am not trying to undermine boards of management, decry them or tar them all with the same brush, but to give parents the real, legitimate input and rights that they should have. From my limited experience of the education system I do not believe they have such input or rights, other than in aspirational and holier-than-thou language. They are not there in reality, and I am going to fight for parents to ensure we get them.Where are we at on the parents' charter? Are there any data or figures available on the number of complaints sent to the Department about the actions of boards of management? That will prove my point that they have not been investigated by the Department in 99% of cases. Has the Department ever disbanded a board of management or removed a member of a board of management?

I rest my case on the answers to those points. Thank you again, Chairman, for your indulgence.