Mr. John MacGabhann:

With the chair's permission I will respond to the questions without necessarily identifying from where they came. First, I want to endorse what has been said in regard to levels 6 and 7. They are absolutely critical, including on a democratic basis. There are a significant number of adults who wish to return to learning but do not have the prior academic achievement that would allow them go directly to level 8. These people are located in the regions as well as in the larger urban areas. We are quite likely now to revisit history in the short term in terms of our once more having a deficit of skilled trades persons because we have not put in place at a sufficient level a floor under the collapse that has occurred in the apprenticeship model. It is vital for economic sustainability that we put in place a floor and that we maintain it. This will have to be done regionally.

Senator Healy Eames asked what the difference would be between a level 8 provided by one institution versus another. I do not mean to be glib but there should not be any significant difference in that regard. The QQI mandates a particular level-----