Pat Rabbitte (Dublin South West, Labour) | Oireachtas source

One of the points made in the Green Paper is that we are inviting responses on the biomass issue. The Deputy is right about the conversion at Great Island. In a country that has very few significant building projects left it is a very big building project. I went to look at it and it is immensely impressive. The conversion from using oil to gas is to be welcomed. It is a very big new limb in terms of our energy security. I am aware of the report published in recent days on the possible conversion of the Moneypoint power plant. The ESB and EirGrid, separately and in a different context, are assessing that issue and it is not as simple as it seems. There are technical and financial questions, but, more importantly, the Deputy identified the question regarding the supply of raw material.

I have representatives of private sector combined heat and power projects coming to me demonstrating a willingness to create a significant number of jobs in some rural parts of Ireland and the question is whether I can guarantee them a supply of raw material. They say they cannot source it because they argue Coillte has a demand for whatever biomass becomes available. If one had to import biomass to feed such a station, one would have to consider the economics. It is not as simple as some consultants claim.

I forgot to answer Deputy Brian Stanley's question on wave and tidal energy. Wave and tidal energy technology is at research stage. Given our status as an island nation, it could be very important in the future. Despite the straitened times we have come through, we managed to continue an investment in the research projects ongoing at a number of locations from Cork to Belmullet, but we will not have an answer today or tomorrow. The same applies to hydroelectricity. One cannot say one is on the side of the angels, in favour of all renewables, and then when we discuss a particular one such as wind energy, ask, "What about hydro?" When there are difficulties with hydro schemes, people propose wave and tidal energy projects. I have had discussions in the Seanad in which there was extraordinarily strong support for renewables, except the particular renewable under discussion.

I am aware of a private sector hydroelectricity proposal. It is a proposal for a remarkable pumped storage scheme which is still being examined and very interesting. To some degree, we are avoiding the issue, which is not whether we have the capacity to generate enough energy to meet our needs however it is broken down between oil, gas, wind, hydroelectricity or biomass. As energy Minister, I would be reasonably comfortable about this and the public does not reflect too much on it. However, when one sees events in Ukraine, for example, there is cause to be nervous at night. Everybody takes it for granted that when one plugs in the kettle or flicks a switch, there is power. Having entered that caveat, I am fairly comfortable about our ability to meet our domestic needs. The hard question Deputy Brian Stanley asked me was related to whether it was wise to create a new traded sector in selling green energy for economic value to the country in terms of employment and revenue. Deputy Paudie Coffey's committee and the elected representatives in Dáil Éireann will be able to make their own input and contribution via the Green Paper.

The expert advice available to me on the transmission system is that given that we have mandatory obligations, we have to upgrade the transmission system. Deputy Paudie Coffey asked to what extent that was due to wind energy generation. We have to upgrade the transmission system if we are to guarantee the people a safe, secure, affordable energy supply and if we are to address questions of dispersal and regionalisation.

We really do not have a choice in the matter. We do, however, have a choice about how we do it and this is where the debate should be centred. People have strong views, which is fine. Let them have strong views, but they should not take up a position of opposition to modernisation of the grid and having a grid which is fit for purpose. I do not suggest anyone on the committee has done so. Whether we put it underground or overground is a reasonable issue for debate but opposition to the notion of modernisation of the grid is Luddite.