Seán Fleming (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail) | Oireachtas source

I understand all that. I look at the Rehab Group in totoand I believe it has a turnover somewhere in the region of €180 million, of which approximately €80 million, or 40%, comes from the Irish taxpayer. Less than half of the income of the group comes from the Irish taxpayer. I can understand why an organisation might make the case, when the majority of its funding does not come from the taxpayer, that it is not fully answerable here. However, RehabCare is a State agency in all but name because it is 98% funded by the State. I would like to ask Mr. O'Brien about that, because people get lost in the debate. There is a general understanding that the vast majority of funding for the section 38 organisations comes from the HSE and that it is a lower percentage in the case of section 39 organisations, perhaps with a service level agreement or a grant payment. Will Mr. O'Brien very simply define the two types of organisation? The public often asks what is the difference between a section 38 and a section 39 organisation. Will Mr. O'Brien tell the public in a nutshell what is the difference? We are in a bubble here and use these phrases all the time but the public is utterly mystified as to the difference between the two.