John Halligan (Waterford, Independent) | Oireachtas source

I welcome the Minister. We have heard much hysteria, spin and hype in the past couple of weeks on the issue which is not helping the situation. GSOC has been in the dock for not reporting to the Minister and the Garda. The situation has been likened to the suggestion that the victim of the crime was to blame for the crime because it did not report to the Garda. I believe it did not report to the Garda because, initially, it believed it was the Garda who had it under surveillance. Subsequently, everything has changed to a position where GSOC, the Minister and the Garda have all cosied up to mend the fractured relationships that certainly exist between GSOC and the Garda. Perhaps I can stick to the facts for a few minutes. Three different potential security breaches were identified between September and October. We all know that modern surveillance techniques ensure that the presence of interception cannot be definitely established. I have checked with security firms and they will tell one that. However, in one of the three instances, the possibility that GSOC was not bugged was rated at close to nil by Verrimus. I think it said that the possibility that GSOC was bugged was "close or nil" or "nil to 1%", but I am near enough to it. This was stated by the countersurveillance company which discovered it. This is a company that has worked around the world and is reported to do a good job when it goes in to do something. We know this to be a fact. Everything beyond that fact is speculation, well-grounded speculation by many people, but speculation nonetheless. The implications of that particular fact is enormous not to mention particularly sinister. It is not simply a question of asking people to move on. That, to me, is patronising, it is offensive and an insult to the intelligence of the Irish people. If one looks at exactly what Verrimus has said, the vast majority of people believe something happened in GSOC. I do not care if it has changed its mind. I believe, based on this security analysis, that something has happened.

The Minister is responsible for overseeing justice, security and policing in our country. Can the Minister say with such certainty - and he said it so quickly - that there was not Garda involvement in the alleged bugging? If that is the case, would the Minister have information that someone else was responsible? We all know that the Americans are putting surveillance on everybody. We also know that the systems that were used or put in place were systems that are used by governments. If the Minister was quick to come out and say that there was nothing, that the Garda did not do it, I come back to what Verrimus said. The Minister is in conflict with Verrimus. Verrimus said that between zero and 1% at least, or, close to nil, there was some counter-----