Brendan Howlin (Wexford, Labour) | Oireachtas source

The Deputy raised two issues, one of which was the focus on outcomes. He instanced the ambulance service. We are moving away from inputs to measure outcomes. Of course, it will be a journey, not a destination; we are not going to change everything instantly. However, from the ambulance service I understand the old idea of an ambulance driver has completely changed. Each ambulance is now staffed by highly skilled and trained emergency medical technicians who can provide first responder treatment at the site of an accident, including treatment for those having a heart attack. This leads to a completely different understanding in measuring ambulance services and responses. I am very conscious that the system must be rolled out. It is happening over time, although we would all like it to happen instantly.

The other point the Deputy makes, on openness, is very valid and I would not mind a bigger debate on it. I find that everybody wants everybody else to be open. All of us, including those of us in the Oireachtas, are always reluctant to have all of our data made available. We all resent expenses being trawled through all the time, but that is the way the system works. We should move away from that attitude.

There are other issues to be considered. The Deputy is absolutely correct that the law, whether it be on freedom of information, whistleblowing or otherwise, is the law. Cultural change is much more difficult to bring about. The Deputy referred to the patient safety agency, on which he made a valid point. One can debate this subject, certainly in the Department of Health, but citation must demonstrably be on the patient side, not the side of anybody else.

Let us consider education, for example. There is a strong view articulated that we should not have real data about outcomes from schools because we do not want to have a league table. Are people entitled to all of the data on outcomes from schools? Would a league table not represent a better assessment of inputs and outputs and a stronger argument for directing more resources to where they are needed? Would it not allow us to discern deficiencies? There are big issues to be addressed in terms of openness, on which we need to have a debate, as opposed to simply saying there are some areas that are untouchable. I have instanced education, but there are other areas in which this principle applies equally. In many cases, there will be a valid reason given on openness. Let us hear the valid reasons and have the necessary discussion. I have made this presentation to the Open Government Partnership. Ultimately, I would like our flagship project to involve an open-data basis for all public information. This is one of the key initiatives I would like to achieve in my term.