Luke Flanagan (Roscommon-South Leitrim, Independent) | Oireachtas source

My first question is for the representatives of the two energy companies. They might be aware of the Bill that is down for First Stage on the Dáil Order Paper. It was originally tabled by Deputy Willie Penrose and, in addition, some colleagues and I, in an attempt to have the proposal debated in a speedier fashion, have also put it forward.

It would create a situation in which the set-back distances would increase by ten times, up to 1.8 km. It would also place the public on a more equal footing in the context of fighting against any proposals relating to this. I imagine those from the two companies are aware that this is out there, particularly as they have invested everything - including all the money they can get their hands on - into what they are doing. What capacity would there be if the set-back distances were of the levels suggested in the legislation to which I refer?

The amount of money that would accrue to the area was mentioned. Has an analysis been carried out in respect of the damage that would be done to existing and future tourism potential if a 1,000 turbines were placed on the landscape? It must be remembered that people often visit Ireland in order to escape from industrialised landscapes.

The core difficulty in respect of this matter, yet again, seems to relate to the fact that a decide-act-defend, DAD, attitude has been taken in the context of the development of the process. Earlier, Mr. Cowhig appeared to make an attempt to make us feel a little bit better about this. I must admit I do not feel any better when I consider the process he stated his company uses. He stated that the first thing the company does is to identify a suitable area, and then it meets the landowners. There could be some big landowners involved but there could also be many individuals living in the chosen area who do not own land there. Did Element Power ever consider holding public meetings and indicating to people what it plans to do? Ireland was mentioned on so many occasions earlier, I gave up counting. What is Ireland? The answer is that Ireland is its people. Without the people, Ireland does not exist; it is merely a rock in the Atlantic. If it is Ireland that is important and if the people are Ireland - I would love someone to prove me wrong on this one - why do our guests wait until the process to which I refer is halfway to completion before they decide to inform citizens of what is happening? If they really cared about Ireland, they would care about its people and include them in the process.

Numerous reassurances have been offered but Ms Doolan blew everything apart when she indicated how she had found out about what was taking place. She discovered what was happening when it was potentially too late and when those operating the process had their minds made up and there was no turning back. Would there not be a greater community gain if the process was actually led by the community? I was extremely concerned by what our guests from Bord na Móna had to say. I noted Mr. D'Arcy's frustration regarding the fact that different counties have different plans. He suggested that perhaps there should be more of an alignment of local plans with regional and national plans. All I can say is, "Well, sorry." I am not a europhile but I like the idea of subsidiarity. Subsidiarity involves a bottom-up approach. It does not involve someone who is damn close to the top bemoaning the fact that the people at the bottom are not co-ordinated in the way he wants them to be. That is what Mr. D'Arcy suggested earlier. This is where the problem lies. That problem arises in the context of pylons, turbines, turf-cutting and everything else in this country. What tends to happen is that something is rammed down our throats and then those doing the ramming return and pour some olive oil down after it in order to make it feel a little better.

What is being suggested and what our guests from Bord na Móna are doing is not going to work with the way they are going about it. The worst aspect of their earlier presentation was the lecture it included with regard to what constitutes global warming and the dangers relating thereto. This was from an organisation that raped and destroyed our bogs. I cut a small amount of turf each year and I and others like me have been blamed for the damage that has been done. I know what global warming is and I understand and have my opinions on it. If Bord na Móna wants people to follow it, I suggest that it should not lecture them and say that they have developed certain opinions on the basis that they are uneducated or do not really understand what global warming involves. This is where our guests are going to fail, because people understand. The problem is that our guests do not understand because they are not listening to people. Citizens have never had greater access to real information. They can now read up on any matter they desire. If one wants something to work, one does not tell people that if they understood the position they would agree to what is envisaged. That will not work.

The position on targets has changed. We no longer have our own targets and there is now an overall target. When the interconnector is built, who will get the credit for it? Will Britain get the credit or will Ireland do so? Is it the case that it does not matter because we are all co-operating? It is similar to what happened in the context of the banking crisis, when we co-operated with Europe and ended up being obliged to pay 42% of the bill. That is the sort of co-operation in which we engage with Europe. I do not know whether the following old wives' tale is true but I am of the view that it is going to come true. It has often been suggested that the dream of the Germans during the Second World War was to invade Ireland and plant cabbages all over the place. That suggestion sounded ridiculous and perhaps that was the case. It seems now, however, that in the context of co-operation, we are going to be the only ones who will be obliged to deal with the fallout from the interconnector and with all that those in Europe can pile on top of us. The decisions are being made in the same way all desperate decisions are made - just as a poor prostitute might make the decision to ply her trade outside her home to feed her kids.