Joan Burton (Dublin West, Labour) | Oireachtas source

I agree with Deputy Collins and that is rather worrying. One of the reasons I am a strong advocate of Ireland's need for a debt deal from the European Union down the road, because of what happened with the banking collapse, is so that we can invest in the training and education of our people. The calibre of jobs that people apply for and the income outcomes are heavily related to the level of education they have undertaken. Essentially, if we have a highly trained and highly educated workforce, then, all other things being equal, the income and wage levels of that workforce will be stronger. However, if we have a low-level or low-paid workforce then the income levels will be lower and the work, as Deputy Collins described, will be more precarious.

Why are we paying jobseekers the family income supplement if they go back to work and they have children? The reason is that the international and national evidence shows that if a person - this applies particularly to young men - becomes unemployed for more than six months then his self-esteem and self-confidence plummets. This happens even if the company closed down. Six months becomes a year, which becomes two years, and then people start blaming the unemployed person. We are spending money on supports in work to employers with JobsPlus. We are spending money on supports to families in work with the family income supplement. This is because all the evidence is that it is better if we can get people back into participation in the labour force, back into education and into participation at local level in community employment schemes, Tús or JobBridge. Some people have come out of college with high levels of qualification but are unable to get a job because of what happened in the recession. If we can get people back to work and then support them with continuing relevant training and education we can raise income levels.

Deputy Collins is right to say that the family income supplement was rather unknown and not taken up. With changes in technology in the Department and on the part of employers' payroll systems, it is far easier nowadays to have FIS applications made in a timely way and we are far better able to respond to it.

Two things are important. The first is to get people back to work. One of the highest levels of minimum wage is in Ireland, at €8.65 per hour. However, if a person only gets ten hours of work, that is only €86.50 per week. A person would be unable to live on that, certainly not if she is an adult with children. We need to get people working enough hours in order that they have enough income. If they need a supplement because they have children then the family income supplement is available. We pay the universal child benefit as well. Anyway, it is important that our system ensures that a person is always better off in work and the family income supplement is a major support to that end.

We are improving it as much as we can. It would be helpful if Deputy Collins or any Member let people know about it. When I was on "Today with Sean O'Rourke", Paddy O'Gorman was in the studio playing the interviews he had done in Navan.

What stood out was that the three men who were very nice people had mentioned having children, but not one of them was conscious that with two or three children he would receive very significant assistance.