Ray Butler (Meath West, Fine Gael) | Oireachtas source

Last week the Minister told me many self-employed people who can afford to do so pay through the nose for private insurance policies for sick pay and disability pay. Many involved in small businesses would not have a hope of paying it. We could examine this system and examine how the Department runs its system.

Ms Kennedy made a presentation and spoke about increasing the rate of jobseeker's benefit by 15% to 16% in addition to core pension, and she also mentioned 17.3% for the entire package. We know this, but the recommendation of the report is to increase the class S stamp from 4% to 5.5%. It is not about the big figures because self-employed people cannot cope with them at present and we know this; it is about the report's findings and recommendations. It recommends sick pay, disability pay and a contributory pension for 5.5%. We want various groups, including ISME, to come on board. The Minister told me last week we do not want to introduce it all in one go, but that it could be introduced in stages of 0.25% over a period of time as the economy improves. We have got bogged down in the system of the Department of Social Protection with regard to self-employed people and nothing is happening. I do not want us to leave this meeting thinking about astronomical figures. We want to push the recommendations of the report to the Government to be included in the next budget and get something done for the self-employed.

There is much confusion with regard to the stamps of self-employed people. I paid an S class stamp for 24 years when I was self-employed. I did not know what it entitled me to because no information is distributed. I would like to see Revenue or the Department of Social Protection tell people what they are paying into and their entitlements. When I lost my business I was a local councillor and I was living on €302 a week to feed a family of four and try to pay my mortgage. I sought family income supplement because I thought I was entitled to it because I was working as a local authority member and paying a stamp through my wages. I could have been told in Longford on day one I was not entitled to it. There was not a piece of cheese to put in the mousetrap to feed the mouse in the house never mind feed the children and pay the mortgage. This continued for 24 weeks, and two weeks before Christmas a letter arrived to tell us we were entitled to nothing. One can imagine the Christmas we had.

I can see where Deputy Bannon is coming from with regard to suicide and self-employed people because I saw many dark days in my household. This is why I am so passionate. People hear me go on about the self-employed and fighting this corner with the Minister. Every time I see the Minister she runs to the far side of the room from me. I am so passionate because I do not want to see what happened to me happen to another self-employed person ever again. As long as I am in Dáil Éireann I will push this as far as I possibly can.