John McGuinness (Carlow-Kilkenny, Fianna Fail) | Oireachtas source

In the context of the comments Mr. Watt has just made, he has heard me refer previously to the Local Government Audit Service. This is a policy matter, which I will not discuss. However, I will state that it is ridiculous that although we have one set of auditors in one location and another set somewhere else, it took action on the part of the Comptroller and Auditor General to reveal information on the cost of waste and issues relating to dumps. Some €119 million in taxpayers' money is at stake here. We received the report in question and we are also aware of the €80 million to €90 million that the Poolbeg project has cost to date. We are now being informed that we cannot investigate matters relating to the other big expenditure in the Department. There is no public discussion about waste in local government or in respect of the figures relating to road and other projects. The figure of €119 million to which I refer came out of the blue. This is a cost to the State for complete inefficiency on the part of local government.

Something must be done in order to establish a relationship between this committee, local government and the Department in the context of its work. I acknowledge that all of those before us play a very important role. I also acknowledge the good things that have come about. However, there is a stubbornness within the system which allows these overspends or inefficiencies to occur. Issues of this nature have been highlighted in successive reports of the Comptroller and Auditor General. I can provide examples. Mr. Watt referred to bringing in a paper and dealing with it. This committee deals with specifics, with the fallout from the system. If that did not happen, there would be less tax to pay and, perhaps, more money to spend.

Some weeks ago representatives from the Valuation Office came before us. I inquired about the valuation tribunal - something about which I previously knew nothing - and was informed that it costs €650,000 to run. The chairman of that tribunal is paid €555 per day and the vice chairman receives €450 per day. A day in this context might be for a sitting or however else they might describe it. Members of this tribunal are each paid €359 per day. If there is a second sitting, the rate drops to €154, €133 and €107 per day for the chairman, vice chairman and members, respectively. Those are handy old rates of pay. I asked the representatives from the Valuation Office why the individuals are being paid these amounts. I inquired whether it is because they are so well qualified and because it is so difficult to find others with their level of expertise that they must be paid at these rates. In response, I was referred to Mr. Watts's Department. When I asked the question I was informed that the Department of Public Expenditure and Reform agrees these matters and that perhaps I should put my concerns to it. Will Mr. Watts indicate why those to whom I refer are being paid that much money?