Billy Timmins (Wicklow, Independent) | Oireachtas source

Based on the discussion, the issues I want to raise are pertinent to the section. We have spoken about this Bill giving rise to clarity. I have much sympathy for the Minister, the Minister of State and those in the Department in trying to formulate legislation arising from what I perceive as a flawed judicial decision 21 years ago. Retrospectively we are trying to legislate for something that has happened.

I am concerned about implementation of the legislation. Does it not set off an alarm for the Minister that so many gynaecologists see a difficulty with this? That is notwithstanding the conscientious objector issue and the ability to move to the next gynaecologist. Is the Minister not saying to himself that there may be something wrong with this when the Master of the Rotunda Hospital, speaking on behalf of all his staff, has a difficulty? What will happen in Portiuncula Hospital in Ballinasloe when somebody arrives, goes through a process and is seen by a gynaecologist who is a conscientious objector and will not do the procedure? How can the head of that hospital employ somebody who will do the procedure or advertise the position? These are very important practical issues.

During the hearings I sought to discover how many minors in the care of the HSE had availed of the X case decision on suicidal intent in order to have an abortion. The Chief Medical Officer told me the executive did not have those statistics but I have since got them through parliamentary questions from the Minister for Children and Youth Affairs. Deputy Mulherin alluded to the six minors in question earlier. Four of those appeared in court but two did not so why was there a differentiation? They were signed off by a psychiatrist. If this process is about protecting the lives of women, why did these minors go abroad for the termination? Why did it not take place in Ireland if it was legal under the X case decision and relevant to a threat to the life of the woman in question?

Deputy Creed touched on my next point, which relates to a patient who may be suicidal and does not want any treatment. That person may be certified by the psychiatrist and the gynaecologist would intervene. The Minister indicated that the same process happens now and the pregnancy is terminated, whether a foetus is viable or not. If the pregnancy is at 30 weeks and the foetus is viable, what happens if the woman argues that under the legislation she is entitled to a termination? What would happen to the child? If it is at 23 or 24 weeks-----