Oireachtas Joint and Select Committees

Wednesday, 29 May 2013

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Social Protection

Pupil-Teacher Ratio in Gaeltacht Schools: Discussion

1:55 pm

Mr. Hubert Loftus:

I deal with a lot of the staffing side of things in the Department. I will let Ms Treasa Kirk talk about some of the issues from the perspective of the inspectorate. As for the lower retention rate for Gaeltacht schools, the context in this regard is that in the late 1990s or thereabouts, improvements were being made in the staffing schedule for primary schools.

At that time 28 pupils were needed for the second teacher in a school. There was one teacher with up to 27 pupils. It is important to bear that in mind. The number was reduced to 12 and now we are bringing it back up to 20 but that is still well below what it was.

The historical retention rates were there at certain points in the staffing schedule for Gaeltacht schools and Gaelscoileanna. They were introduced as part of the improvements. Money was available in the late 1990s and early 2000s and there were slight reductions in our demographics which were stable or falling a bit. We had scope in funding and teacher numbers to make some improvements and the policy decisions at that time were to make improvements in small schools. We are in the opposite position now. We have no money and we have significant increases in our demographics. We are trying to manage our funding in such a way that we are able to have a teacher in all the classrooms which need one. As a result, as part of these phased increases, there are more pupils in the classroom but the most important factor in education provision is the quality of the teacher and the supports the teacher has, as distinct from whether there are one or two extra pupils in the classroom.

Reference was made to the review and analysis the Department is undertaking of Gaeltacht provision and forward planning and in a sense putting the cart before the horse. It is important to recognise that the review and the recommendations that might flow from it need to be done in the context of what we can afford as a country in staffing small schools. That report will be published and all the stakeholders and colleagues here will be involved in that. There is no point doing a review that does not reflect the fact that the country cannot afford a high level of staffing resources because we do not have the money.

Deputy McConalogue mentioned that the lower retention rate for Gaelscoileanna was standardised and that retention rate was withdrawn for Gaelscoileanna as part of budget measures for budget 2011 under the previous Government. That budget measure would have resulted in some higher jumps for the schools at that point and it was done in one single jump. The current budget measures for small schools generally, including for Gaeltacht schools, are being introduced on a phased basis. The other key change, compared with the budget measure for Gaelscoileanna, is that there is a new appeals process was introduced for the small schools that enables them to retain their teacher based on projected enrolments for the following September. The net effect of that in 2012 was that the budget measure, as it affected Gaeltacht schools, was a loss of six classroom posts. The overall staff in Gaeltacht schools is over 600. That helps to put things in context. The budget impact on Gaeltacht schools in 2013 is evolving but as of now there are four schools that will definitely lose a classroom post. That might rise marginally but it will be of that order. Where a classroom post is lost there are standard redeployment arrangements in place for teachers in those posts and they are redeployed in line with those.

The small schools value-for-money review was also mentioned today. My colleagues in Tullamore lead that review but as far as I understand that review is now completed and went recently to the Minister. It is on his desk and he will be considering it with his Cabinet colleagues. That will be published in due course. The Minister has indicated that when that is published it will be given to this committee for discussion here.

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