Brendan Howlin (Wexford, Labour) | Oireachtas source

I thank the Chairman for facilitating today's discussion. I do not think any other proposal has received the same scrutiny as this initiative to date. We have had debates, questions and numerous motions in both Houses on the issue. I welcome that because it is important that we rigorously consider all proposals. I strongly reaffirm the views I expressed on Second Stage on the national lottery as it has been run for a long time. It was interesting to read the older debates, in which grave concerns were expressed about what the original licence for the lotto would do. Most of those fears, concerns and opposition were proven over time to be unfounded. It was a good initiative which provided billions of euro for good causes. Like all good ideas, however, it is not stuck in aspic. We have to revisit it in terms of the requirements of our times. These are unprecedented economic times and we have to look at every asset and initiative we have as a State to see how we can contribute to the reconstruction of our economy and providing for the needs of today's people. I have no doubt that many of the concerns expressed are genuinely felt by Members of both Houses, and I have said that repeatedly.

To deal with the specifics of the matter, we live in extraordinarily challenging economic times. The licence is due to be renegotiated and retendered anyway. There is no escaping that. This is not a decision I made arbitrarily. We need to tender for the licence in the normal way. I have heard views expressed to the effect that we should almost fix who should get it, although nobody around this table has suggested that. We cannot do that. We have to tender and we will see how much interest is expressed in running the lottery in future.

An idea I have advanced and which the Government supports is to use the opportunity of issuing a new licence to seek a significant upfront payment. Deputy Boyd Barrett is wrong to suggest it is being given away. It is quite the reverse. We want to get a significant upfront payment that will enable us to invest a big chunk of it in building the new national children's hospital. When I was setting out the multiannual capital programme, I had to find a significant amount of money for the health area. One of the decisions I made was to preserve the capital expenditure profile for health because we need to refurbish our hospitals and provide new emergency departments and health centres in order to change the focus from acute care to primary health care. We are going to do that as well as providing the new children's hospital as the flagship project of this Administration in terms of capital works. It is a good idea to ring fence a tranche of money for that project. I disagree with the view expressed by Deputy Boyd Barrett that we should simply raid the income stream of the current lotto and take €50 million away from sports, the arts and all the other good causes that currently receive money in order to invest in the children's hospital. That is a point of view that I have encountered elsewhere. If we could both maintain the flow of money to good causes and build the children's hospital by being innovative and creative, that would be a good and proper thing.

There are people who are against change. I have found that to be the case since my new Department was created as a Department of reform. We are an extraordinary people to be resistant to reform. Everybody is in favour of the concept but regard the subject of reform to be somebody or something else. We should have an open mind and a proper debate and analysis. This new licensing regime will give a 20-year horizon to the successful bidder. It sets up an entirely new structure of regulation because an independent regulator will determine all the issues that are important in terms of integrity, probity and ethos. The amendments I have tabled on Committee Stage provide for the long-term sustainability of the national lottery in order to protect its integrity even beyond the term of the licence.

From my discussions with the Minister for Justice and Equality I also realise we need to set out a view on regulating gambling in any event. The lotto has been a good and careful mechanism for gambling but a significant amount of gambling is now migrating online, where we have little control over it. The Minister is anxious that the proposed new regulator will migrate from having responsibility for the lotto to regulating gambling in general, including protecting online gambling in respect of underage people or over exposure.

These are challenging issues in an age of technology but are the type of issues with which we need to grapple. While I fully acknowledge the concerns expressed by people in terms of this new departure, objectively it is the right way to go. The proposal has been carefully crafted and balanced, will have a good impact, will provide an up-front payment for the children's hospital, protect an income stream for good causes and, hopefully, grow an income stream beyond what is a diminishing one. I should point out that all products like this need refreshment. Some of our problems over the past number of years are partly related to economic downturn. When one looks at international best practice, that these things run out of steam and need to be regenerated. Given the level of business conducted online these days, it is necessary to refresh this in any event. Much of what is in this set of proposals is aimed at doing so.