Mr. Matt Dempsey:

I thank the Senators and Deputies for their good wishes, which are very much appreciated. While I was aware of the legal position, I would have been very disappointed if the committee had unanimously recommended to the Minister that he reconsider my appointment. That was all I meant by my remarks.

With regard to Senator Mooney's point, there are two aspects to the development of a stallion. The book fee of our current stallion, Invincible Spirit, is €60,000. Presuming that he serves 120 mares, that gives an earning capacity of over €7 million per year. From the pure arithmetic, one realises the considerable impact that one successful stallion can have on an operation of a very significant size. This holds true right across the stallion business in the country.

The amount of money that accrues from a successful stallion can be very significant. On the other hand, the losses from a misplaced investment can also be very large. It is quite a risky business. Happily, the record of the Irish National Stud in sourcing good stallions of various categories and grades has been very successful. In that context Invincible Spirit has been a real find.

How does a stud develop? One is dependent on the skill of the manager and his team, coupled with the advice of some of the specialists on the board. Part of the manager's job is to be aware of what is happening worldwide, how various two year olds and three year olds are performing, what animals are likely to be for sale, and how well disposed existing owners are to seeing a stallion stand at the Irish National Stud, or have the stud as a customer. It is quite a restricted world at that end of the stallion spectrum. One is competing with world players in the same market. A combination of expertise and goodwill is required and one must be in the right place at the right time and meet the right people. The chief executive manager of the Irish National Stud, Mr. John Osborne, has a pivotal role in the success of the operation. Part of the board's role involves some of the more specialist members providing Mr. Osborne with a sounding board for his views and opinions and assisting with whatever introductions are required and the knowledge available worldwide. It is also a question of what mares one gets, how successful the stallion is in the first few years, and how it develops from there.

Consider the spin-off effect in the Japanese Gardens and the 120,000 visitors, which figure was raised by a number of members. The gardens are obviously a very significant tourist attraction. The bulk of the visitors are domestic. There is widespread interest in gardening internationally, however, and most Japanese tourists who come to Ireland make it their business to see the Japanese Gardens. There is a very extensive collection of international plants in the gardens, so keen botanists come regularly, as do families for a day out.

The intention is to build on that. I take the Senator's point on advertising in recent years and whether it should be augmented. Obviously, this will be examined and we will be discussing it. The Queen's visit had a major spin-off with much interest expressed in the stud. The horse facilities at the stud are available to public viewing so empathy can be created between the ordinary taxpaying public and one of the State's institutions.

It is hoped a profit of €500,000 will be made in 2013. Last year, the stud under Lady O'Reilly and John Osborne did a bit better than break even. This year is looking more promising and the minimum expectation is that a profit of €500,000 will be earned. Regarding the question on syndication and sharing of stallions, this is an active part of the stallion business. It is highly desirable that a number of rights in good stallions would be held by individual breeders from across the spectrum that would be purchased by the stud. This is part of the normal thoroughbred life and the National Stud is an integral part of that on a strictly commercial basis with breeders who wish to participate. The sums involved in purchasing a high-class stallion can be very significant. The National Stud has no great desire to be looking for funding from the Exchequer. A borrowing limit of €30 million has been set by the Government but it is hardly used at this stage as the debt level is very low. There is a legal capacity to buy but we want that to be matched by a commercial reality.

I must admit the question on sports horses is an interesting one. Professor Patrick Wall has been designated the chairman of Horse Sport Ireland. These are really two different businesses. Certainly before committing that that would be my policy, I would prefer to get a feeling from the board and from John Osborne. I would be surprised if I could detect an overwhelming enthusiasm to get involved in the sports horse sector when there is so much ground to be covered on the thoroughbred side.

The best land for horse breeding is a combination of the brown earths and the grey-brown podzolics. While I loved my time opening Manorhamilton show, the amount of those particular soil series in Leitrim is pretty limited. The depth of soil across most of the limestone plains of the west, except for odd pockets, is not in my view conducive to training the highest grade three year olds with the potential to be classic winners. A neighbour of the stud near Kilcullen recently invited us to lunch. Within four miles of that estate, the classic winners Sea The Stars, Frankel and Camelot had spent some time in their formative years on this land. There is a clear association between definite soil series and land type. This is what has attracted international investors to parts of Cork, Kildare, Kilkenny and isolated pockets elsewhere. I say that without denigrating any other part of the country.