Seán Fleming (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail) | Oireachtas source

I welcome the Minister of State. I thank him for attending in the absence of the Minister, Deputy Howlin. I will make a few points and ask a few questions.

As the Minister of State said, there are approximately 290,000 people in the public service. I do not know how many public service pensioners there are. Approximately 10% of our 290,000 public servants are civil servants. The round figure is 30,000 or thereabouts. We are dealing with a Supplementary Estimate that relates to the pensions of retired civil servants. As I have said, civil servants account for approximately 10% of public service numbers. Can the Minister of State explain what is being done for the 90% of public servants who do not have the facility whereby a Minister or Minister of State can come in and seek an additional Supplementary Estimate to cover their pensions? If a local authority is finding it difficult to make additional pension payments in the last six weeks of the year, having already made payments to staff who left earlier in the year, it cannot ask the Department of the Environment, Community and Local Government for an extra €300,000 to cover these costs. It has to suck it up. It has to find the money somewhere.

Most people who retire from the public service are employees of the HSE. The Department of Health is the only Department that has yet to give us the details of the Supplementary Estimate it requires. At this late stage, with less than a week to go until the budget for next year, the dysfunctional Minister in question cannot even give us a figure for the Supplementary Estimate for this year. I do not know whether that Supplementary Estimate will make provision for pensions to be paid to staff who retired during the course of the year. It might not. I do not know. Some 10% of public servants have direct access to the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform through the Civil Service. As long as the Dáil has a vote on a special motion, they are able to have their pensions dealt with. That does not apply to the other 90% of public servants. I want to know what kind of equality will apply. What will happen to pensions in local authorities, State agencies and semi-State agencies?

I would have preferred to address my second point to the Minister, Deputy Howlin. The Department of Public Expenditure and Reform is a spanking new Department. As it was established some time in 2011, this year has been its first full year in existence. Given that it has been lecturing every other Department on the need to come in on budget, this has been one of its first big tests. The Minister of State has given us some excuses to explain why its figures in relation to this issue were wrong. That is not acceptable in the real world.

I ask him to explain subhead A4 to us again. According to the briefing notes, some €116 million was provided under that subhead in the original Estimate for this year, but we have now been told that the anticipated spend is €139 million. The difference is €23 million, or approximately 20%. The Minister of State mentioned in his opening statement that factors like the number of people expected to retire, the current staffing levels and the need to make provision for people leaving were considered when the original Estimate was drawn up. The Department's figure was 20% wrong. The original Estimate under subhead A4 was €116 million and the anticipated spend under that subhead is €139 million. The Department miscalculated by 20%. I wonder whether it would have got its sums wrong to this extent if this issue was still being dealt with under the Department of Finance. This is a serious criticism of the Department of Public Expenditure and Reform. We will subject the Department to critical analysis. We have not had a Supplementary Estimate like this in the area of superannuation and retired allowances for a number of years. I suspect that in the old days, the Department of Finance would have projected its figures more accurately earlier in the year. I want the Minister of State to deal with that.