Ms Patricia Callan:

The idea was that this group would send material to the Action Plan for Jobs to be delivered. The Department of Social Protection is not deeply into engaging but we will do our best. We have done a great deal of detailed work on the issue of sick pay. In the UK they spent two years discussing this, looking at it, examining it and travelling up and down and looking at the issues around sick certificates and looking at all the mechanics in terms of rebates and systems. After all that they decided to do nothing because of the recession. That is the person the Minister for Social Protection, Deputy Joan Burton flew in to tell us that we should bring this system in. At that presentation the OECD also sat on the fence. Fundamentally they were talking about different models in different countries and how great it was and when I asked them what actually happens in terms of insurance products for smaller companies, they said they forgot to mention that small companies are exempted. We know that the Minister said she would exempt small companies but the Department promptly retracted that. It is a debacle. It needs more assessment, and work before one can justify it. From our perspective the Minister is just trying to get it out of her Bill and it will be absolutely critical to smaller companies, even in pure cash flow terms having to trump up €188 rather than the equivalent of €90 in the North would persuade somebody like Mr. Ian Martin to locate a job there. One then gets the money back. There is far more complexity.